The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR General Discussion Thread - - - - - - - - - - Part 142

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

The movie didn't need it... but yes, a mention would have been nice.

It would have been no more forced than the ''Robin'' line.

 

[I Am The Knight]

It really gets on my nerves that not a damn thing is mentioned of Joker in this movie. Every single villain in the series was at least mentioned but Joker? Oh that guy?!?!? We just threw him in Arkham and never thought about him ever again. Ugh

They talk about the events of TDK troughout the movie but no one mentions the Joker.

Ridiculous.

Also, is there any particular reason why Crane is the judge? I mean besides going "full circle" with a cute cameo.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[AnneFan]

Catwoman really put steam in Batman's strides.

 

[Victarion]

Catwoman really put steam in Batman's strides.

He never slept with skin-n-bones in this film.

 

[Tequilla]

Also, is there any particular reason why Crane is the judge? I mean besides going "full circle" with a cute cameo.

Aren't psychiatrists , judgmental figures ?

Also in Begins he "sentenced" people in trial to the asylum with his evaluations. Its a simple throwback.

 

[I Am The Knight]

Aren't psychiatrists , judgmental figures ?

Also in Begins he "sentenced" people in trial to the asylum with his evaluations. Its a simple throwback.

More like a stretch, really. There was no mental evaluation of the people being sentenced, at all. People where there because of what they had "done". The why or how didn't matter. It was merely a sentencing court, where people could decide their sentence....

The only connection Crane had with the LOS was that he was a "pawn" for Ra's in BB. But even then, it seems like a fimsy excuse to have him back in a role like that. He wasn't even privy to what their actual plan was.

It was done for dramatic purposes. I don't see a real reason why he was there all of a sudden.

 

[Tequilla]

Off course its a stretch. Im not the writer of the movie. I just tried to answer your question.

I think psychiatrists many times are seen as not supposed to judge a patient , yet they end up being very judgmental in the process. Him being in that position , fits really well considering his occupation. It's very ironic.

 

[BatmanBeyond]

That's gold, sir, bravo.

 

[Victarion]

More like a stretch, really. There was no mental evaluation of the people being sentenced, at all. People where there because of what they had "done". The why or how didn't matter. It was merely a sentencing court, where people could decide their sentence....

The only connection Crane had with the LOS was that he was a "pawn" for Ra's in BB. But even then, it seems like a fimsy excuse to have him back in a role like that. He wasn't even privy to what their actual plan was.

It was done for dramatic purposes. I don't see a real reason why he was there all of a sudden.

You could look at it as Crane getting what he wanted. In Begins he told Rachel he liked running the Asylum because it gave him power over those who hold power beyond its walls. He got the same deal as the Judge.

 

[BlueLightning]

And after all, while seeing The Dark Knight, I was expecting that he made an appearance in the sequel. Cillian Murphy does a good job, so if a court will be held... why not Scarecrow?

And as for The Joker going unmentioned, I believe that if Heath had not passed away, he would have gotten a cameo for this film. But it would have been inconsequential. Bane is too smart to let the Joker loose, being the wild card he is, he could threaten his plan.

If the Joker was not going to appear, being unmentioned on the film is the best, after all, on film, he was a monster better left forgotten. The character is just too big, mention him would be just a unjustified tease if he wasn't going to appear.

 

[Victarion]

If Ledger was still with us, I could see Bane cutting off any entrances/exits to Arkham and throwing Bruce in there after breaking him. Then you get a nod to the Arkham Asylum comic admidst the Knightfall/No Man's Land stuff.

 

[BlueLightning]

In that case, you would lose the pit, which would lead to a entirely different film.

 

[BatLobster]

I think Crane was put in that position of power, because he was a pawn, and a nutty, but loyal one at that. He thought the LOS was only going to hold the city randsom with his fear toxin, but didn't seem to care at all when they released it.

It's like in Begins when they let him out of Arkham..."Time to play". Same idea. Crane gets to have a blast squeezing fear out of people with his mallet, the LOS have someone in their back pocket overseeing the proceedings.

 

[Nightwing 52]

 

[CJ]

 

[Blue_Scholar]

NO WAY!

 

[The Joker]

Also, is there any particular reason why Crane is the judge? I mean besides going "full circle" with a cute cameo.

No Scarecrow mask, no fear gas, it didn't feel like a Scarecrow cameo. If anyone was suited for that kind of role it was Joker;

And as for The Joker going unmentioned, I believe that if Heath had not passed away, he would have gotten a cameo for this film. But it would have been inconsequential. Bane is too smart to let the Joker loose, being the wild card he is, he could threaten his plan.

What makes you think the story would have turned out the way it did if Heath was still alive? What makes you so sure the LOS would have been brought back, or even a siege of Gotham would have been done?

I think if the Joker was still an option, the story would have been different to what we got.

If the Joker was not going to appear, being unmentioned on the film is the best, after all, on film

Well then there was no point in mentioning Harvey Dent, Rachel, or Bruce's parents either by that logic.

he was a monster better left forgotten.

But how can he be forgotten when everything that happened in TDK was a result of him? He destroyed Dent, he killed Rachel, and he forced Batman to take the blame for Dent's crimes just so "The Joker cannot win". All of those things were in TDKR.

Your logic is not why Nolan omitted a mention of him. It was out of respect for Heath.

The character is just too big, mention him would be just a unjustified tease if he wasn't going to appear.

Nonsense. As if a verbal reference to him from the events of TDK could be called an unjustified tease.

 

[shauner111]

Bane would never leave Joker in that kind of power or even outside of an institution, nor would Joker want to just let Bane take over and be OK with it. Crane was better suited as the judge.

 

[The Joker]

Bane would never leave Joker in that kind of power or even outside of an institution, nor would Joker want to just let Bane take over and be OK with it. Crane was better suited as the judge.

That kind of power? I didn't know sitting on a Judge's bench asking people if they wanted death or exile was such a powerful position lol. Any idiot could have done it.

You're right about Bane and Joker never working together, but in context of who would have been better in a cameo like that, it's Joker not Crane. We know he likes to play dress up;

He'd have made a more interesting Judge. He knows how to mind screw people.

 

[Hawkeye70000000]

Here is a link that explains not mentioning the joker and a possible reason to where he was during the movie. http://www.**************.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=64543


It was out of respect to Heath ledger that nolan didn't mention the joker. If Heath had not passed away then he would have had a role in the film. An entire different movie would have been made.

 

[TheBat812]

Off course its a stretch. Im not the writer of the movie. I just tried to answer your question.

I think psychiatrists many times are seen as not supposed to judge a patient , yet they end up being very judgmental in the process. Him being in that position , fits really well considering his occupation. It's very ironic.

I think also he's a well known figure in the world of the convicts and is a man who likes power and doling out fear. I like the irony of using a man who sought power in charge of punishing those who abused theirs.

 

[TheBat812]

That kind of power? I didn't know sitting on a Judge's bench asking people if they wanted death or exile was such a powerful position lol. Any idiot could have done it.

You're right about Bane and Joker never working together, but in context of who would have been better in a cameo like that, it's Joker not Crane. We know he likes to play dress up;

I would have loved to see that, but he's right, Joker would never be satisfied being confined to just being the judge. The whole story would probably have to be different to have Joker involved and do him justice. I honestly don't think they would have brought him in for too much because thematically his role is done. The point of Joker was to challenge Batman's code and make him turn on his values. His role was done after TDK. Obviously they would have tried, but I just don't think it would have worked out, and they would have moved on. Also, like Nolan said, he wanted a new kind of threat.

 

[BatLobster]

I would have only approved of that Joker cameo if he created the court inside Arkham and Bane had absolutely nothing to do with it.

Even though Crane says "Bane has no authority here", it's clear that Bane is still presiding over the proceedings.

I enjoyed Crane's cameo, got a nice applause at my midnight showing. Needless to say, if Heath were alive and they had managed to keep that a secret, it would have blown the roof off, regardless of how little sense it made. But still, always great to see Cillian.

 

[The Joker]

I would have loved to see that, but he's right, Joker would never be satisfied being confined to just being the judge. The whole story would probably have to be different to have Joker involved and do him justice. I honestly don't think they would have brought him in for too much because thematically his role is done.]

I'm not saying he would have wanted to be the kind of Judge that Crane was. I said a villain in a Judge type role would have have been more suited for the Joker. Crane's didn't have anything Scarecrow about it. No mask, no fear gas, nothing. It was just Crane offering people a choice.

I honestly don't think they would have brought him in for too much because thematically his role is done. The point of Joker was to challenge Batman's code and make him turn on his values. His role was done after TDK. Obviously they would have tried, but I just don't think it would have worked out, and they would have moved on. Also, like Nolan said, he wanted a new kind of threat.

No, Joker conceded at the end of TDK that Batman was incorruptible, and because of that and the fact that Joker would not kill Batman, it meant they were destined to do battle forever.

Joker wanted to win the battle for Gotham's soul. Because his ace in the hole for that victory was covered up by Batman and Gordon, his work was FAR from done. He would not have sat idly by and let that go on indefinitely.

The Joker had more justification to come back than the LOS did. Begins ended it with them defeated. Bruce even said in TDKR that Ra's was the LOS and he beat him. Bane and Talia did not hail from Begins in any way, and were made up creations in TDKR.