The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR General Discussion Thread - - - - - - - - - - - Part 143

[BlueLightning]

Again, for the most part I feel TDKR suffers from over-ambition, not under-ambition.

Agreed. Sometimes I think the film can barely sustain itself. There is this introspective story about this man painted in an enormous canvas. Sometimes I think that the IMAX time restriction was an issue, and the fact that the original screenplay from Jonah was very long adds to this particular problem. Despite that, the end product is astounding. The movie could have invested a lot of time in different areas. But the fact that Nolan was able to successfully focus on Bruce's character and to use this enormous world and situations to do so is certainly remarkable.

 

[BatLobster]

I don't think the issue is so much that Nolan got lazy...its that he actually got more hands-on, even with the script, this time around, and the quality of the script and the storytelling suffered for it. Chris Nolan is a great idea guy, and he understands archetypes, thematics, etc, but that doesn't mean he's a great writer.

Spoiler

 

[JAK®]

People forget that The Avengers is part of a continuing story.

 

[Alex Logan]

Avengers is definitely fun, but I found it lost some charm on home video. I loved my theatrical experience with a packed house. All of us were laughing and clapping throughout. Without the communal experience, it loses some of its luster for me. Still a really good movie and probably my 2nd favorite from Marvel Studios, slightly behind the first Iron Man film.

I found myself thinking this too, it lost someting when I bought the Bluray. I won't put it as my second favorite from Marvel though... more like tenth.

 

[Alex Logan]

It's no contest for me. As fun and lighthearted as The Avengers was, I found that a lot of the charm wore off after the first viewing, personally. I never felt any real emotional connection to it, and I don't feel like there's enough to sink my teeth into to keep coming back to it. The one big emotional beat in the film (Coulsen's death) is already being retconned/was a lie to begin with. There's just very little in the film beyond the admittedly fun action that appeals to me (Hawkeye is pretty cool too). And for all the talk about Avengers being the big, bright counterpart to Nolan's dark and gloomy Bat-flicks, I found TDKR to have a more resonantly positive, life affirming message at its heart, with a lot of genuinely fun moments peppered throughout.

I respect the opinion of everyone who loved it because I recognize that I am clearly in the minority. It's just one of those things where I'm not sure I'll ever quite get the hype. I have a feeling I'll like Iron Man 3 a lot more than The Avengers.

I couldn't agree more. The emotional connection was huge for me, Coulsen's death was screwed up by the comic relief.

I think calling TDKR phoned in is probably the worst insult one could throw at Nolan. He's made it very clear that his philosophy on movies is that if the filmmaker is half-assing it, the audience can detect it. That is part of why he is so adamant about shooting things practically whenever he can. I think you can criticize TDKR for a number of things, but Nolan not caring or being lazy is just not one of them. Just like all his other movies, there's a lot of passion there and the thing feels very labored over, even in areas that didn't necessarily have to be.

I would say perhaps his priorities shifted more towards telling a more grand, more visually based story (using the silent era as an influence, for example), but I think he was emotionally invested in the project and it came across to me. When you take on a project of that size you're leading your entire cast and crew into battle. Frankly I'd be shocked any single one of them felt that he led them astray or lacked the passion or vision necessary to hold something so gigantic together. All you hear is about how great the atmosphere on set was.

Pretty much.

 

[the5timechamp]

I keep waiting for Bane to show up at the Superbowl..power went out and everything...

 

[kvz5]

Twitter is blowing up with "Bane's here! Where's Batman?" jokes right now.

 

[the5timechamp]

This keeps popping up a lot too.. Turtle peeps wont let it go..

 

[Doctor Who]

I was looking around, and I came around to an interesting coincidental realization:

When Nolan worked on TDK, he had Heath Ledger look at some of Francis Bacon's artwork to be inspired for the feel of Joker he was aiming for in his adaptation. If you notice in the art gallery scene of the original Batman, as Nicholson's minions flaunt around destroying everything, he prevents Bob from slicing one particular painting. And I just noticed NOW that it was indeed Figure With Meat... by yours truly, Francis Bacon.

 

[the5timechamp]

Wow..

 

[ThePhantasm]

That's right, though this is actually the particular painting by Bacon that they used as an inspiration for Heath's Joker...

 

[Anno_Domini]

Everyone here was screaming out Bane references and then my phone tweaked out of texts...of Bane references, lol.

I immediately thought, "Well, next is the field blowing up."

And quite ironically...in the end, it was Ray Lewis that pulled a Batman that is retiring and riding off into the sunset.

 

[AnneFan]

I was looking around, and I came around to an interesting coincidental realization:

When Nolan worked on TDK, he had Heath Ledger look at some of Francis Bacon's artwork to be inspired for the feel of Joker he was aiming for in his adaptation. If you notice in the art gallery scene of the original Batman, as Nicholson's minions flaunt around destroying everything, he prevents Bob from slicing one particular painting. And I just noticed NOW that it was indeed Figure With Meat... by yours truly, Francis Bacon.

The user 'redhawk23' posted the analysis on this page:
http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?p=25008055&highlight=francis+bacon#post25008055

 

[Kane52630]

You merely adopted the dark.

 

[Anno_Domini]

[YT]amOXMEjW0og[/YT]

 

[georgec]

I still think it's funny how adamant people were that Blake was only Blake and not Nolan's amalgamation of the Robin character, hinging their obstinate denials on one quote from Nolan where he said he wouldn't do Robin. Although it was always clear to me that quote mainly referred to the yellow tights version, or that in the Schumacher films.

But despite the evidence and logical progression of Nolan's Batman story, much of which was grounded in BB when Bruce wanted Batman to be a long-lasting symbol and not necessarily one man, those threads were full of angry denials. Just wish I could have seen the looks on some people's faces when they saw TDKR for the first time, as it became clearer and clearer that Blake was "Robin". Must have been torture. Then in the end Nolan literally tells the audience, "His name is Robin." LOL!

I just never understood why the idea of Blake being "Robin" set people off.

 

[Travesty]

I just never understood why the idea of Blake being "Robin" set people off.

Because for some, it sucked major ash.

 

[Anita18]

Francis Bacon was one disturbed mofo.

 

[ShadowBoxer]

Those Bane jokes got on my nerves during the Super Bowl last night. I mean it was funny the first few times I saw the grifs and whatnot but after like the 10-50th time I saw the joke on my Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram feed it got OLD. I mean us comic book fans/ nerds lol sure do know how to wear out a joke. Similar to the Skyrim video game joke Arrow To The Knee.

 

[ShadowBoxer]

But yea the more I watch Dark Knight Rises the more it goes down in quality for me. It just wasn't the epic conclusion everyone was hyping it up to be. Plus there are plot holes, useless characters and unintentional funny moments (Talia's death ). I mean its still a good movie but The Dark Knight still blows it out the water without question.

For me its

The Dark Knight
Batman Begins
The Dark Knight Rises

 

[BatLobster]

TDKR was, by definition, an epic. Unfortunately we've all abused that word so much that it's just come to mean "good".

 

[super85]

Francis Bacon was awesome. There is a great documentary about him, made by David Hinton in the late 80s. Highly recommended.

I agree with what many of you said. I really enjoyed the big scale popcorn fun of The Avengers when I saw it at the cinema. Ordered the Steelbook Bluray of it, and wasn't nearly as entertained the second time around.

I saw The Dark Knight Rises 4 times in the cinema. Have watched it a few more on Bluray at home. I really love it. Think of it as a almost perfect ending to the the trilogy. And it feels like it is about stuff, even if it is big spectacle too. I care more about it .

 

[Anno_Domini]

Those Bane jokes got on my nerves during the Super Bowl last night. I mean it was funny the first few times I saw the grifs and whatnot but after like the 10-50th time I saw the joke on my Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram feed it got OLD. I mean us comic book fans/ nerds lol sure do know how to wear out a joke. Similar to the Skyrim video game joke Arrow To The Knee.

Bane tried to turn the lights off on the other half of the stadium but he took an arrow to the knee.

TDKR was, by definition, an epic. Unfortunately we've all abused that word so much that it's just come to mean "good".

Indeed it was an epic. And the epic film is the best of the trilogy, imo.

 

[ThePhantasm]

Begins and TDK weren't epics?

 

[BatLobster]

I think Begins and TDKR both have more of the feel and scope of what would traditionally be considered an epic, but TDKR takes it to another level. Our hero gets his very own chant...'nuff said.

TDK was epic more in the "HOLY SNAP THAT WAS EPIC" sort of way, but I like to think of it as the crime film/thriller of the three.