The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR General Discussion Thread - - - Part 152

[antsman41]

Outside of the comic accurate suit, and the 4 year old in me that wants Batman/Superman interact in live action... I have no desire for this series. MOS was very meh for myself, felt bloated and badly edited even though it was nice to get a Superman film post the 80's that didn't harbor to the old quadrilogy.

It's not like I'm never going to the theaters for new DC films but I probably won't ever have the crazy interest like I did with Nolan's trilogy. The days pouring over set photos/videos, promos, marketing campaigns, trailers, and so forth are petty behind me... especially with The Hype's annoying new rules.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

If a good script is all it took for Snyder to make a good movie, then why are all of his movies so divisive?

Let's go with your theory, are you gonna tell me the man is so unlucky that hasn't received a good script HIS ENTIRE CAREER?

I find that a stretch. Based on his career thus far, I have to assume that there is something inherent in his directing that alienates people. Nobody is so unlucky as not to have a good script their entire career.

Besides, a good director can mold a bad script into something watchable. David Fincher has been doing that for the majority of his career.

 

[The Batman]

All I know is, Chris Nolan helped write the story for MOS, and it still turned out mediocre, IMO

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Didn't Goyer say he wrote the script with full autonomy?

 

[Snow Queen]

The story I don't think was an issue, it's the actual script. A great script could have been made based on that story, but Goyer given free reign (at least as I understand it) was a bad idea.

 

[The Batman]

Didn't Goyer say he wrote the script with full autonomy?

I'm just going off the credits....but if Goyer did write it by himself...it explains a lot.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Yes. The film could've been a satisfying examination of Free Will vs Destiny.

But what we got instead was Jor El, the guy bred to be a science guy, easily taking out several people bred to be warriors. And then actually defeating the general in hand to hand combat.

I wonder if that was even in the script. Or Snyder got too excited over the idea of Shannon vs Crowe that he "added" to it. Nullifying the movie's themes in the process.

 

[I Am The Knight]

Agreed. I wonder if the mentality was "Well he was Maximus so audiences will want to see him fight someone", perhaps?

 

[Brother Jack]

There are some really great ideas in Man of Steel. Things like the S symbol being a Kryptonian glyph for the house of El, the suit originally belonging to Clark's father, etc. I was even on board with Lois knowing Clark is Superman right off the bat because it minimizes the narrative gymnastics they'd have to go through to keep her in the dark. But a lot of those things are not fully developed. The question of what the people of earth would do with the knowledge of extraterrestrial life isn't show despite being raised again and again.

As far as Snyder directing a good script... Has that ever actually happened?

 

[shauner111]

I think this is the last shot for Snyder, for me of course. Maybe for a lot others as well.

The guy finally has the cinematography and possibly a good script from Terrio (not guaranteed either). So if it's all visual spectacle and nothing else, i may throw in the towel before Justice League. Because this is his opportunity. If he fails at Batman v Superman, there's no way he's going to deliver anything but a visual frenzy for Justice League with nothing else. I do think he can do it because the pieces seem to be coming together but there's still that part of me who thinks he's not going to pull it off due to his track record.

Im also afraid that he'll fail since i don't want this Batman wasted. Im 99 percent sure this upcoming movie will do crazy numbers in the box office but imagine if it doesn't?? I doubt they would move forward with Justice League or the many spin-offs. Hypothetically they cancel films like Cyborg, Green Lantern, Flash etc if JL or Bats/Supes did s**tty numbers. As you can tell im not thinking positive with Snyders universe.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

Snyder's directed some of my favorite movies in Dawn of the Dead and Watchmen, I think with a good script he'll turn in a pretty solid movie.

But a lot of people who don't like Snyder will have already made their mind up about BvS. I think Affleck being involved is really gonna help the integrity of the movie.

 

[BatLobster]

I've always been someone that wants to like Snyder. On paper there is so much there for me to like, and his last two trailers (Watchmen and MOS) had be creaming my pants with anticipation, yet the movies ended up falling flat for me to differing degrees.

I do still think 300 is a cool movie though, that movie was pretty much exactly what it needed to be. And I think Watchmen was a hell of an effort to film the unfilmable book, about as good an attempt as you could hope for.

So I don't think Snyder is horrible by any means, but I just haven't fallen in love with any of his movies the way I've wanted to. If any movie is to buck that trend, I would love for it to be BvS.

 

[The Batman]

I think a lot of people want to like Snyder, even some of his detractors. I think thats why so many people constantly make excuses for him.

 

[Shikamaru]

As a teen, I used to love Snyder. In fact, I distinctly remember thinking to myself "I don't understand how anyone cannot like Snyder." I had that thought after seeing 300 and Watchmen.

I may get some crap for this, but the man is a style-over-substance director. At least most of his work has been that way. The difference between him and someone like Bay though, is Snyder's style at least comes from the heart. You can tell that at least in his mind, he's trying his best to bring these characters to life and not disappoint the public.

 

[BatLobster]

Yup, I agree. That's why, like I say, I want to like him. I think he genuinely tries and has good intentions, and his passion is clear.

Whereas with Bay, there's a more cynical feeling of him just pandering to the LCD.

 

[shauner111]

300 was fine but i don't care for the source material so it's not very interesting to me. Some fun moments there, for sure. But the whole CG + slow motion + Snyders obsession with ripped dudes was a little eye rolling.

I liked Watchmen but didn't love it. I liked some of the casting a lot, disliked others. The visuals were stunning and i applaud that. It's incredible to look at. I was locked in with the Rorschach and Comedian scenes but felt myself not caring for the rest. Probably Zack's best film though. Gotta see Dawn of the Dead again. I only saw it once in theaters and now when i think of the movie i think of that scene in 40 Year-Old Virgin "***** GET OUT THE ROOM!!!"

The guy is likeable as a person just like Guillermo Del Toro but their films don't do much for me. If he can take the better parts of MOS and do Batman like a Watchmen/Dark Knight Returns/B:TAS hybrid....with a better script....i could love the movie. I hope that's what we get but it might be a lot to ask for.

 

[shauner111]

I may get some crap for this, but the man is a style-over-substance director. At least most of his work has been that way. The difference between him and someone like Bay though, is Snyder's style at least comes from the heart. You can tell that at least in his mind, he's trying his best to bring these characters to life and not disappoint the public.

Absolutely. It's what Zack loves, and that's cool. I just don't care for style over substance movies. Del toro has that passion too. Pacific Rim was something he wanted to make for kids and he succeeded. It just wasn't for me.

 

[BatLobster]

I like Del Toro, but Pacific Rim...oof, that was a chore to sit through.

 

[Shikamaru]

Del Toro at least has some well received films under his resume.

Plus, Pacific Rim was very honest about what it was trying to be. It wasn't trying to be super intelligent or super relevant like MOS and not deliver on it.

 

[Kane52630]

I love Del Toro ever since I saw Blade 2, but watching his earlier stuff makes me love him even more. The Devil's Backbone and Mimic are absolutely incredible and I still need to see Cronos.

 

[Kane52630]

As for Snyder I think he's only got one bad film on his resume (Sucker Punk), other than that I've either liked or love his films. Not all directors are perfect, even Nolan gave us an incredibly dull film with Interstellar.

 

[shauner111]

As for Snyder I think he's only got one bad film on his resume (Sucker Punk), other than that I've either liked or love his films. Not all directors are perfect, even Nolan gave us an incredibly dull film with Interstellar.

Interstellar might be one of my favorite movies of all time right now. I loved it as much as Birdman and Whiplash last year. Following is dull to me. Insomnia too at times but i adore Interstellar.

 

[Snow Queen]

As for Snyder I think he's only got one bad film on his resume (Sucker Punk), other than that I've either liked or love his films. Not all directors are perfect, even Nolan gave us an incredibly dull film with Interstellar.

Following I'd say is the only dull one he's done. Interstellar was the best of the year, in my opinion.

 

[Travesty]

As for Snyder I think he's only got one bad film on his resume (Sucker Punk), other than that I've either liked or love his films. Not all directors are perfect, even Nolan gave us an incredibly dull films with Interstellar, Following, Insomnia and The Dark Knight Rises.

Totally agree, especially the last part.

 

[shauner111]

Sorry to hear you're no longer interested, I do hope that you end up liking it at least. Or that there'll be something that interests you.

I'm going to have to disagree with you on Flash, but yeah I absolutely agree with Cyborg. I don't mind Cyborg (though not a character I care about either), but there are better picks for leading characters and founding JL members. If he's there because they wanted a black member, why not John Stewart? And if they wanted Hal still, why not have them both on JL and make Green Lantern something of a buddy cop movie with John as the more experienced member and Hal as the rookie? Though I suppose both on the team would be a bit redundant power wise. I don't know, but I'm sure if that were the reason they could find someone better than Cyborg.

Overall the universe I think has potential but I don't trust the current team to use that potential and characters/teams I'd like to see lead films likely will not, which puts a damper on that for me. Those being, just off the top of my head here, Batwoman, Birds of Prey, maybe a Black Canary/Zatanna teamup ala Bloodspell, Gotham City Sirens, Power Girl would all be great to see but I doubt we'll be seeing any of them (as leads, to be clear).

From what we know now of the universe, I'm only particularly interested in Wonder Woman, Suicide Squad, the inevitable Batman solo and kinda BvS though that one's significantly more apprehensive than the others. I can see the potential for Flash and Green Lantern to be good but at this time I'm not interested. And Cyborg I don't remotely care about. Justice League I'm not too interested in either, as I'm concerned about them not focusing enough on the characters and instead it being too action driven. But hopefully I'm wrong and it's good. Wonder Woman I think has a pretty solid director, is a character I love and is her first full live action feature film. Hopefully Gadot's actually good, otherwise that's going to be really disappointing. Suicide Squad I think also has a good director at the helm and I really like Harley so I'm excited to see her on screen for the first time and I like who they case. However, losing Hardy for Kinnaman, if true, is disappointing as Hardy is a much better actor of the two of them. Also not a fan of Will Smith or Jai Courney. That being said, Ayer managed to get me not to hate Shia Lebouf in Fury so I'll give it the benefit of the doubt there for now. And then the Batman solo is pretty obvious why. BvS I like most of what I'm hearing but Snyder just worries me.

I only saw your post now, sorry about that!

I hope the new movies interest me once i see some trailers. I dont mind Cyborg in the Justice League, i think it's a fine move (not that i would hate Martian Manhunter added instead) but John Stewart should get a movie before Cyborg. I see a Green Lantern movie with Hal training John and then the universe continues with Stewart. But there's a rumor that WB has plans for Stewart which is why they wont let television use him. If that's the case, it's possible Ezra Miller is playing Wally West and Green lantern will be John in Justice League. Maybe they've had enough with Hal?

I think some of those characters you list could potentially have their own spots on television but im not too sure about the films.

I really liked Fury and everyone was great in it, Shia especially. It gives me hope for Suicide Squad but what doesn't is the casting. I feel like i only care about the Joker/Harley situation. Let's be honest, she's probably leaving the Squad or she's playing them all along. So the actual "Suicide Squad" portion of the film is not looking great to me. I've been bored with Will Smith since I Am Legend. That was the last thing he did that locked me in. I think i was more pumped to see Hardy square off in scenes with Will but now that's gone.

Wonder Woman can be truly great and so can Batman but im not sure about the rest.