Why women are stupid, The Myth of "The Nice Guy"

[PyroChamber]

Sometimes I just think women have strange ways of thinking.

 

[spike spiegel]

"Mood ring oh mood ring
Oh tell me will you bring
The key to unlock this mystery
Of girls and their emotions
Play it back in slow motion
So that I may understand the complex infrastructure that is the female mind"

But seriously, men and women do have different psychology to them, but I think we're more alike than we may tend to think.

 

[Eggyman]

It's a problem created by both sides. There's some truth, and then there's also some injustice.

Truth: Some nice guys CAN be snivelling and spineless, earning no respect from the woman who may want more than a lap dog.

Injustice: Not all nice guys are like that ^. Don't generalise.

 

[The Kid]

No, you'll increase your chances of scoring if you visibily demonstrate who you are and what you have to offer, and it fits into something that is socially accepted.

I can't bring myself to believe that anymore. Maybe it works in some social atmosphere's more than others but definitely not where i come from.

A lot of the time, jerks win out because they are simply more demonstrative. That, and they tend to have better surface attributes, which leads to the mindset of them not having to try with women, and so they act like jerks.

True and the jerks out there I believe are not only more persistent but evoke an overwhelming sense of sexual dominance which I've discovered is a factor in whether you get some. Sometimes it just comes down to those simple primal instincts.

Right, but do they become putty because the men are jerks, or because the men demonstrate an ability to exert control, and some level of confidence?

I'm almost completely certain it's about their ability to demonstrate their sexual dominance which is unfortunately linked to how cold hearted and cruel they can be. (Screw it, I am completely certain.) We have to find some kind of balance between being tender and being callous... fun. i believe you said something about that earlier.

Don't look for that weakness to just disappear as they get older. It just doesn't work that way with most people.

Damn...

Actually, the reason women usually want the asses is because someone else wants them, which makes them appear more desirable. Monkey see, monkey do.

true.

And even if he wants a long term relationship, odds are he'll still want sex on some level.

Damn right.

 

[ComicChick]

its all about the nice guys lol, what bout the nice girls? we get no love either

and i can't speak for all females, just myself, but i find the acting like a jerk completely unattractive. when you're trying to act like a jerk to get with a girl or something, the key word is act. i'm not attracted to guys who try to brag and show off or try to put on airs to impress people.

it's what you do when you think no one is watching that i look out for.

there was a guy i was 'talking to' at one point, totally cool and everything around me, one time he didn't think anyone was around, his true self came out. complete and utter prick. i wasn't attracted to him after that.

and on the other hand, so i don't appear a hypocrite. there has been a guy or two that i wasn't initially really attracted to, but once i saw him when he didn't know i was around, i saw some of the good things he did/said/etc, i grew more attracted.

 

[DarknessOfDeath]

its all about the nice guys lol, what bout the nice girls? we get no love either

and i can't speak for all females, just myself, but i find the acting like a jerk completely unattractive. when you're trying to act like a jerk to get with a girl or something, the key word is act. i'm not attracted to guys who try to brag and show off or try to put on airs to impress people.

it's what you do when you think no one is watching that i look out for.

there was a guy i was 'talking to' at one point, totally cool and everything around me, one time he didn't think anyone was around, his true self came out. complete and utter prick. i wasn't attracted to him after that.

and on the other hand, so i don't appear a hypocrite. there has been a guy or two that i wasn't initially really attracted to, but once i saw him when he didn't know i was around, i saw some of the good things he did/said/etc, i grew more attracted.

Hi.

 

[SpideyVille]

its all about the nice guys lol, what bout the nice girls? we get no love either

and i can't speak for all females, just myself, but i find the acting like a jerk completely unattractive. when you're trying to act like a jerk to get with a girl or something, the key word is act. i'm not attracted to guys who try to brag and show off or try to put on airs to impress people.

it's what you do when you think no one is watching that i look out for.

there was a guy i was 'talking to' at one point, totally cool and everything around me, one time he didn't think anyone was around, his true self came out. complete and utter prick. i wasn't attracted to him after that.

and on the other hand, so i don't appear a hypocrite. there has been a guy or two that i wasn't initially really attracted to, but once i saw him when he didn't know i was around, i saw some of the good things he did/said/etc, i grew more attracted.

some people might find that creepy
but i understand what you're saying

 

[ComicChick]

some people might find that creepy
but i understand what you're saying

if you take it literally lol, yeah it does sound kinda creepy/stalkerish.

but seriously though, you can really tell fake people from sincere just by observing them 'when the cameras are off' so to speak.

that's why those hidden camera shows used to be such a hit, cuz it shows how ppl really act, no chance to put up facades and crap

 

[SpideyVille]

if you take it literally lol, yeah it does sound kinda creepy/stalkerish.

but seriously though, you can really tell fake people from sincere just by observing them 'when the cameras are off' so to speak.

that's why those hidden camera shows used to be such a hit, cuz it shows how ppl really act, no chance to put up facades and crap

lol yeah i know what you mean. I used to do the same thing whenever i was around a girl. I would always try to "be on my best behavior" in the event that maybe she was watching me at all times. I eventually realized that doing that wouldn't help me as much as i thought. Sure she might be interested in me, but if she would try to get to know me she would just be disappointed to find out that inside i'm not the same as i was trying to be outside, and then she'll completely lose interest. Now I'd rather just be myself at all times, that way if a girl becomes interested, i'd know it's for being who i am not someone else.

 

[ComicChick]

lol yeah i know what you mean. I used to do the same thing whenever i was around a girl. I would always try to "be on my best behavior" in the event that maybe she was watching me at all times. I eventually realized that doing that wouldn't help me as much as i thought. Sure she might be interested in me, but if she would try to get to know me she would just be disappointed to find out that inside i'm not the same as i was trying to be outside, and then she'll completely lose interest. Now I'd rather just be myself at all times, that way if a girl becomes interested, i'd know it's for being who i am not someone else.

switch the genders at the appropriate parts and i can relate

 

[The Kid]

So if a guy has no confidence, no humor, no money, he'll have to beat you nice girls off with a stick?

....

I think every guy here knows that's not true. We have to put up a fascade. Since this a comicbook forum, compare it to a secret identity vs the superhero.

 

[SpideyVille]

I think every guy here knows that's not true. We have to put up a fascade. Since this a comicbook forum, compare it to a secret identity vs the superhero.

But that's the thing. It shouldn't have to be that. You should be able to love someone for who they are not who they try to be. And sure, you can compare it to having the dual identity, but does it always work out when heroes do that? When the hero's love interest finds out about the dual identity, they are shocked to discover the person they loved was keeping a big secret from them and realize that they truly don't know that person as well as they think. Then they have to decide whether they'll stay with the person and accept them for who they are and work things out, or leave the person because they see the person as a completely different person. That's the risk you take when you decide to put up a facade. And if a person can't love you for who you really are, there's no point in being with that person because the side that you hide will eventually come out and they're going to disappointed that they were decieved like that.

 

[terry78]

She Says vs. He Says: Do Girls Really Like Dating Jerks?

By Christine Hassler and Jason Ryan Dorsey
Special to Yahoo! Personals Updated: Feb 24, 2008
Christine Hassler and Jason Ryan Dorsey




SHE SAYS: No, but we think we do. As someone who dated a jerk, whom I now refer to as my "learning experience," I admit to falling under the jerk spell.
Here's how the jerk spell works: we meet the jerk and in some twisted way are seduced by his confidence, charm, and passion. We don't see these as the disguises they are: confidence is really arrogance, charm comes from him being a player, and his passion is being the center of his own universe.
“The jerk sniffs out our insecurities and uses them to reel us in with compliments that eventually turn into criticisms.”
The jerk sniffs out our insecurities and uses them to reel us in with compliments that eventually turn into criticisms. And if we see a red flag, like the time my "learning experience" told me his definition of a relationship was "light, fun and physical," we play mind games with ourselves. We use our normally rational inner voice to convince ourselves that we can tame him or that with the right kind of girlfriend he will lose his jerk armor and transform into a leading man fit for a romantic comedy. Come on ladies, what are we thinking?!
A jerk loves being a jerk -- way more than he loves us. I guess if they've always gotten away with treating people poorly and nobody ever set them straight, why would they change? Besides, a jerk seems to always have an attractive woman on his arm laughing at his mediocre jokes and ignoring his wandering gaze. How? I think it's because deep down every woman wants a challenge or a little danger. It's not really the jerk we like; it's the thrill of the chase, the rush of adrenaline when the jerk's phone number pops up on our cell (which is usually right after last call).
However, it's been my experience that "jerkdom" isn't some phase we can pull a guy out of. Guys only outgrow that phase when life no longer succumbs to their demands. Any woman who has dated a jerk for more than a week knows that it's a hollow relationship that ultimately leaves you disappointed, hurt, and commiserating with your friends.
The only challenge worth overcoming when dating a jerk is to not let him affect or define your self worth. So if there is a jerk out there making your heart go pitter-pat and estrogen is messing with your reasoning, go ahead and let him woo you, but when he asks for your number tell him that you only date guys who prove their value by respecting a woman. If he's a jerk he'll roll his eyes, say you have an attitude and snicker as he leaves. If he sincerely accepts your ground rules, then chances are you should give him at least one date to prove he's relationship material. Although you may not be spellbound at first, the nice guy without all the smooth answers may ultimately fulfill your needs in more meaningful ways.
HE SAYS: As much as I hate to say it, girls love jerks! At least until the jerk stops calling, which is usually right after he gets what he wants. Speaking from the guy's perspective, I've never quite understood what draws sane, attractive, bright women to guys who act like jerks. Maybe it is the thrill of the unexpected. Maybe it is trying to outplay him in his own game. Maybe it is hoping that deep down he is a nice guy and you are going to prove it to your naysayer friends. What I do know is that too many women who could easily be in a healthy relationship instead choose the cliffhanger ending of dating a jerk that walks with a swagger, winks at anything that moves, and always has a one-liner at the ready.
“Truth be told, there aren't many nice guys who haven't considered acting like a jerk, especially when they steal your girl”
Truth be told, there aren't many nice guys who haven't considered acting like a jerk, especially when they steal your girl (here I speak from experience). However, daydreaming of jerkdom fades as soon as nice guys remember one thing: being a jerk means acting like a jerk all the time. That means causing the mental pain and emotional anguish that drives a girl to phone her friends -- guy friends included -- crying about what the jerk did to her in public on their first date. Even guys bear the brunt of girls who fall head over heels for jerks.
If you're a girl who feels worse about yourself with every jerk you date, I hope you will make a big move towards respecting yourself and go on a date with a nice guy. They may not offer the drama and constant criticism you've come to expect, but they also won't try to hook up with you after dropping off their other girlfriend. And if you are having trouble distinguishing between a jerk and a nice guy, here are three ways to tell:

1. He's probably a jerk if he tells you to skip desert because your butt already jiggles enough.
2. He's definitely a jerk if he "guilts" you into doing things that make you feel bad about yourself -- usually starting with the line "If you really cared about me..."
3. He's absolutely a jerk if he takes you on a date and leaves you the bill, while he leaves with the waitress.

 

[SpideyVille]

She Says vs. He Says: Do Girls Really Like Dating Jerks?

By Christine Hassler and Jason Ryan Dorsey
Special to Yahoo! Personals Updated: Feb 24, 2008
Christine Hassler and Jason Ryan Dorsey

SHE SAYS: No, but we think we do. As someone who dated a jerk, whom I now refer to as my "learning experience," I admit to falling under the jerk spell.
Here's how the jerk spell works: we meet the jerk and in some twisted way are seduced by his confidence, charm, and passion. We don't see these as the disguises they are: confidence is really arrogance, charm comes from him being a player, and his passion is being the center of his own universe.
“The jerk sniffs out our insecurities and uses them to reel us in with compliments that eventually turn into criticisms.”

I think these are what really separates the "nice" guy from the "jerk". The jerk really does see himself as being superior to the girl and feels like they have to control the girl, and it doesn't help when there are girls who subject themselves to this belief and allow it to continue. The nice guy on the other hand, realizes that they are on the same level as the girl. They also feel no need to control her for she is her own person who should make her own decisions.

And the biggest difference is that "jerks" know when to make their move. They see when a girl is vulnerable and take advantage of her and her feelings in order to get what they want, while the "nice", though he may see this same weakness, he refuses to take advantage of the girl in a moment of weakness. Even though there are times where we feel like it's our best shot to get a girl, that doesn't mean it's okay to do it.

We use our normally rational inner voice to convince ourselves that we can tame him or that with the right kind of girlfriend he will lose his jerk armor and transform into a leading man fit for a romantic comedy. Come on ladies, what are we thinking?!

Are there girls that actually think like this? I mean if you fall for the guy because he looks strong and confident, what makes you think you can suddenly change that. It's not like he's gonna lose his confidence and suddenly become a pushover.

A jerk loves being a jerk -- way more than he loves us. I guess if they've always gotten away with treating people poorly and nobody ever set them straight, why would they change?

Exactly. Most guys tend to act like jerks because they see all the other guys acting like jerks and get rewarded for it. Why would they change if nobody points out what they're doing is wrong.

The only challenge worth overcoming when dating a jerk is to not let him affect or define your self worth. So if there is a jerk out there making your heart go pitter-pat and estrogen is messing with your reasoning, go ahead and let him woo you, but when he asks for your number tell him that you only date guys who prove their value by respecting a woman. If he's a jerk he'll roll his eyes, say you have an attitude and snicker as he leaves. If he sincerely accepts your ground rules, then chances are you should give him at least one date to prove he's relationship material. Although you may not be spellbound at first, the nice guy without all the smooth answers may ultimately fulfill your needs in more meaningful ways.

Unfortunately, there are some jerks that are smart enough to know when to hide that "jerk" part of them, and it's usually when they have the woman's attention and see she's not falling for whatever he's doing. So he "changes the play" and pretends to be a nice guy just to get in with a date. After that, he'll continue with his normal jerk behavior.

HE SAYS: As much as I hate to say it, girls love jerks! At least until the jerk stops calling, which is usually right after he gets what he wants. Speaking from the guy's perspective, I've never quite understood what draws sane, attractive, bright women to guys who act like jerks. Maybe it is the thrill of the unexpected. Maybe it is trying to outplay him in his own game. Maybe it is hoping that deep down he is a nice guy and you are going to prove it to your naysayer friends. What I do know is that too many women who could easily be in a healthy relationship instead choose the cliffhanger ending of dating a jerk that walks with a swagger, winks at anything that moves, and always has a one-liner at the ready.

Why must girls always try to prove things to their friends. I really hate it when girls have to have their friends' "seal of approval". Honestly, if you're only going out with me because your friends think it's a wise move, then there's already a problem. And this also holds true with "naysayer" friends. It shouldn't matter if your friends don't like the guy. If you like him then give him a chance. After all, YOU know what's best for yourself, not your friends.

Truth be told, there aren't many nice guys who haven't considered acting like a jerk, especially when they steal your girl (here I speak from experience).

Absolutely true. Most guys are nice guys, but they become jerks because they see that's what the girl they want prefer. What they should be thinking is that if that's what the girl prefers, then she just isn't the right one for you.

1. He's probably a jerk if he tells you to skip desert because your butt already jiggles enough.

If a guy does this, he isn't just a jerk, he's a really really dumb guy.

2. He's definitely a jerk if he "guilts" you into doing things that make you feel bad about yourself -- usually starting with the line "If you really cared about me..."

Another good way to distinguish how much of a jerk a guy is, whether he seems nice at first or not.

3. He's absolutely a jerk if he takes you on a date and leaves you the bill, while he leaves with the waitress.

 

[Mac_Hine]

1. He's probably a jerk if he tells you to skip desert because your butt already jiggles enough.

If a guy does this, he isn't just a jerk, he's a really really dumb guy.

I would absolutely say this to a girl. Why would that make me a jerk & dumb in your opinion though? I would say this with a sly smile and an obvious playing tone. It's not what you say but the way you say it (playful like the way you would joke with your buddies busting each other's chops).

 

[SpideyVille]

I would absolutely say this to a girl. Why would that make me a jerk & dumb in your opinion though? I would say this with a sly smile and an obvious playing tone. It's not what you say but the way you say it (playful like the way you would joke with your buddies busting each other's chops).

Yeah you're right. I totally wasn't thinking about it that way. Though sometimes even when you joke about something like that, most women tend to overreact and take it seriously. Like the popular question "Does this dress make me look fat?", the girl could be skinny as a toothpick but if you say yes in a joking manner, there's a chance she might not share that humor and take offense to that answer. But yeah you're right, i was only focusing on it as if a guy was serious when he said that.

 

[Trainwreck2100]

I was having this conversation with three other friends yesterday all college aged. The other guy there was complaining about not having a girlfriend. Then I told him you need to be more of an Ahole, chicks like the challenge. Which drew criticism with the two girls we were with. Ten minutes later they were complaining about how their boyfriends were such Aholes.

 

[PyroChamber]

This is an argument that will go on for years and years.

 

[LexCorp]

I believe Lex was talking about a woman who finishes a guy because he treats her well. That's what he was replying to. He wasn't, as far as I can see, addressing the matter of first meetings. The way I read the posts was that this was already an existing relationship where little to no assumptions need to be made concerning intentions and such.

And in those circumstances, I agree with his post.

Edit: Sorry for the mix up. He said the same thing in two different posts.

Yes Eggyman

 

[The Kid]

But that's the thing. It shouldn't have to be that. You should be able to love someone for who they are not who they try to be. And sure, you can compare it to having the dual identity, but does it always work out when heroes do that? When the hero's love interest finds out about the dual identity, they are shocked to discover the person they loved was keeping a big secret from them and realize that they truly don't know that person as well as they think. Then they have to decide whether they'll stay with the person and accept them for who they are and work things out, or leave the person because they see the person as a completely different person. That's the risk you take when you decide to put up a facade. And if a person can't love you for who you really are, there's no point in being with that person because the side that you hide will eventually come out and they're going to disappointed that they were decieved like that.

I wish it worked that way but it doesn't. The harsh reality is that if you don't put on your tights and save some lives, Lois will ignore you...

 

[LexCorp]

I wish it worked that way but it doesn't. The harsh reality is that if you don't put on your tights and save some lives, Lois will ignore you...

Lois is an attention ****e.

 

[Eggyman]

Lois is a ****e.

Fixed

 

[LexCorp]

Fixed

Woman are ****es - I jest

 

[Eggyman]

Don't be so rude.

 

[LexCorp]

Don't be so rude.

Don't be so egg