The Dark Knight Rises You Have My Permission To Lounge - Part 6

[The Joker]

I would say there is no amount of alcohol to help me get through watching 3 hours of that, but that would be a lie

A Beautiful Lie, that is!

[YT]hUVwR0rw5fk[/YT]

 

[Tacit Ronin]

DC's worst crime is making amateurs out of professional filmmakers. They would slap you with a D in screenwriting 101 classes if you had a character stare at a bike in the middle of a scene and go into a five minute digression that has nothing to do with the rest of it.

But welcome to the DCEwww, where being lazy and terrible is worn with a badge of honor.

 

[ThisGuy4000]

Yeah, and they didn't originally write Joker with Harley in the show. Or even introduce her as his gf. Timm and Dini didn't intend for Harley to be a long term character. Again what you keep ignoring is that she was not even introduced as his gf. She was not intended to be that, or even appear beyond one episode. They didn't even introduce the Joker with her. He had several solo episodes before Harley appeared.

If they were so concerned that Joker might seem gay they'd have had him with Harley as his gf from the get-go. The only reason she stuck around beyond one episode is because the fans loved her. So they gave her a plausible back story as to why a beautiful young woman would so loyally follow an insane clown continually.



I never said he was repulsed by the idea of sex, I said he's not interested in it. The fact he is more interested in coming up with a plan to get Batman rather than get laid by Harley in her sexy lingerie to the point where he kicks her out in the dirt shows how uninterested he is in sex. In fact name one single scene in BTAS that shows Joker interested in getting romantic with Harley.



I have no idea why it's there. The movie is loaded with pointless additions that were unnecessary. The whole Paris Franz story being a prime example of it. The kangaroo court scene with Joker, his circus freaks and Gordon is another.

Tell me you're not ignorantly suggesting that's why so many people like it. Because they're blinded by nostalgia.



No offense but that's a ridiculous reason to lose all respect for him. That's like losing all respect for Steven Spielberg, and all his brilliant movies he's done are suddenly irrelevant, just because he made weak movies like Hook or The BFG.



I can't even take you seriously any more.

Again, I still don't buy this idea that she was created as a one-off character, especially considering that she would continue to appear throughout the first season of that show. It takes more than just a few weeks to write and animate an entire season.

Also, I haven't seen BFG, but I can't imagine its as bad as a movie where we get some awkward animated sex scenes between Batman and Batgirl. It helps that I'm not crazy about Bruce Timm's work in general. He seems too concerned about depicting his own fetishes in animated form, and I don't care for that crap.

 

[The Joker]

Again, I still don't buy this idea that she was created as a one-off character, especially considering that she would continue to appear throughout the first season of that show. It takes more than just a few weeks to write and animate an entire season.

Where on earth did you get the idea they wrote and animated the entire 65 episode season in just a few weeks? Even when you look at the air dates between Harley's episodes after Joker's Favor, there are several week gaps between them.

Also, I haven't seen BFG, but I can't imagine its as bad as a movie where we get some awkward animated sex scenes between Batman and Batgirl. It helps that I'm not crazy about Bruce Timm's work in general. He seems too concerned about depicting his own fetishes in animated form, and I don't care for that crap.

Apart from the recent TKJ movie, where have we had awkward sex scenes between Batman and Batgirl in the DCAU?

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Jesus Christ, Joker's dialogue. I've read fanfiction with more refinement. Who wrote this ****?

I can't be loved because I am an idea? Ideas are loved all the time. In fact, ideas endure longer than people.

Apparently Killa Croc only eats out men.

 

[ThisGuy4000]

Where on earth did you get the idea they wrote and animated the entire 65 episode season in just a few weeks?

I didn't. That's why it seems illogical to suggest that Harley Quinn was meant to be a one-off character until the fans insisted that they include more of her.

Apart from the recent TKJ movie, where have we had awkward sex scenes between Batman and Batgirl in the DCAU?

I was referring specifically to TKJ. That being said, his work in general is littered with obnoxious sexual innuendos.

As a side note, collateral damage tends to be a pretty big problem in the DCAU, just like with the DCEU. Didn't Superman punch Darkseid through a bunch of buildings in the final episode of JLU? That's also not getting into the fact that Wonder Woman was pretty unlikable and aggressive in the DCAU, and that her relationship with Batman felt like yet another example of Bruce Timm implementing his fetishes into his work.

Look, you obviously love the DCAU, and that's fine. Let's just agree to disagree.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Hey look, going into the rabbit hole stairway shot. If I had a dollar for everytime Hollywood reused it I would be rich.

Harley is demonstrating olympic level athleticism and american level cardio.

Oh great, another flashback! When fanfiction is better written than a Hollywood film it's time to take a step back and assess the damage.

The first F bomb in a DC flick! Albeit in a song.

Leto's voice is such a ripoff of Ledger. He couldn't come up with anything new?

His laugh is new, admittedly. A new low. It's terrible.

 

[The Joker]

I didn't. That's why it seems illogical to suggest that Harley Quinn was meant to be a one-off character until the fans insisted that they include more of her.

Why is that illogical? Fan popularity is what makes writers bring characters back.

I was referring specifically to TKJ.

You said awkward sex scenes between Batman and Batgirl. Scenes being plural suggests more than one. So I assumed you were saying Timm has done this a few times.

That being said, his work in general is littered with obnoxious sexual innuendos.

Back in 1992, the same year BTAS debuted, Batman Returns got a parental backlash for sexual innuendo and violence, that's why we ended up with Schumacher's more kid friendly camp fests.

Do you honestly think BTAS, a Saturday morning cartoon, would have gotten away with being peppered with obnoxious sexual innuendos?

As a side note, collateral damage tends to be a pretty big problem in the DCAU, just like with the DCEU. Didn't Superman punch Darkseid through a bunch of buildings in the final episode of JLU? That's also not getting into the fact that Wonder Woman was pretty unlikable and aggressive in the DCAU, and that her relationship with Batman felt like yet another example of Bruce Timm implementing his fetishes into his work.

Never watched JLU so I can't comment. But given your track record of interpretations on Timm's work in this discussion, I'm guessing it's not as half as bad as you say.

Look, you obviously love the DCAU, and that's fine. Let's just agree to disagree.

Fair enough.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

The power of love has disarmed Harley's bomb?

Waller suffers from the Lex Luthor syndrome. She alternates between viciously smart and embarrassingly dumb. She is brilliant because that's her character. She is dumb because that's the writer's 'brilliance'.

Stuff is happening just out of convenience now.

 

[ThisGuy4000]

You said awkward sex scenes between Batman and Batgirl. Scenes being plural suggests more than one. So I assumed you were saying Timm has done this a few times.

My mistake then. The scene was still pretty bad though.

Back in 1992, the same year BTAS debuted, Batman Returns got a parental backlash for sexual innuendo and violence, that's why we ended up with Schumacher's more kid friendly camp fests.

Do you honestly think BTAS, a Saturday morning cartoon, would have gotten away with being peppered with obnoxious sexual innuendos?

http://http://dcau.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_sexual_innuendos_and_double_entendres_in_the_DCAU

Never watched JLU so I can't comment. But given your track record of interpretations on Timm's work in this discussion, I'm guessing it's not as half as bad as you say.

http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl_5UwS57X8

Fair enough.

Thank you. If it's any consolation, I actually do like Mask of the Phantasm. I may dislike Timm and Dini's work for the most part, but that doesn't mean there isn't the rare exception.

 

[The Joker]

My mistake then. The scene was still pretty bad though.

Nobody seemed liked that scene. TKJ movie in general is not very popular. I have no desire to rewatch it, and I love the comic book story.

http://http://dcau.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_sexual_innuendos_and_double_entendres_in_the_DCAU


http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl_5UwS57X8

Neither of these links work for me. Are you sure you copied the URLs correctly?

Thank you. If it's any consolation, I actually do like Mask of the Phantasm. I may dislike Timm and Dini's work for the most part, but that doesn't mean there isn't the rare exception.

You're free to like or dislike what ever you want. I don't need any consolations over your own opinions. I just find your reasoning behind them to be totally bizarre and inaccurate.

 

[ThisGuy4000]

Neither of these links work for me. Are you sure you copied the URLs correctly?

I guess I didn't. I'm admittedly not quite sure how to provide workable links on SHH. You could copy and paste them though. That ought to work.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

This is actually a deep film if you think about it in terms of being a metaphor for America's inhuman, ghastly prison industrial complex. Where incarcerated men and women enter into a literal hell on earth where they transform into a more terrible monster instead of rehabilitation.

I ain't kidding.

 

[The Joker]

I guess I didn't. I'm admittedly not quite sure how to provide workable links on SHH. You could copy and paste them though. That ought to work.

The Youtube link is not working, but your other one I guessed from the broken URL name. I assume you were trying to post this;

http://dcau.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_sexual_innuendos_and_double_entendres_in_the_DCAU

Are you really trying to say dialogue like this is obnoxious, offensive, or inappropriate;

Talia: I'm truly sorry, Batman. It could have been sweet.

Selina Kyle: Your mother called, darling, said you could use some cheering up. And who better for the job than the woman you're marrying next week.

Gil: At least you won't have to worry about Barbara. I'll take good care of her. She's very fond of me, you know.

Dick: I just thought it would be fun to get together, and study, and talk, and...
Cindy: And?

Bruce: I'll call you tomorrow, Ronnie. I promise.
Veronica: I've heard that one too.

Batman: You're hot.
Catwoman: Now you notice...

Arthur Reeves: You know, it's not good to go to bed with a full stomach. We could stay up. Talk for a while...

I'm sorry, but until you find dialogue akin to this from Batman Returns;

Penguin: "Just the ***** I've been looking for"

Penguin: "I'd like to fill her void"

You're grasping at straws calling those quotes obnoxious innunendos. Especially between characters that are supposed to have some sexual chemistry like Batman does with Selina and Talia.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Harley wants a middle class life with Jared Leto with two kids? Da ****?

 

[ThisGuy4000]

I guess you could just type up "World of Cardboard" on YouTube, and you should find the video.

Also, the stuff you listed is hardly the most annoying of the sexual innuendos in those shows. It's not even so much that I find them offensive, I just think they're incredibly juvenile and forced.

 

[The Joker]

Harley wants a middle class life with Jared Leto with two kids? Da ****?

The worst thing about that scene is she was imagining it as total normality. Normal looking kids, Joker looked like normal handsome Jared Leto, and they were living in a normal house.

It implies she wants him to change and be normal rather than loving him as he is and the crazy lifestyle they have. Harley's dreams of married life with Joker should look cuckoo crazy like this;

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Go Latino Human Torch! Destroy Scorpion King!

Katana really loves his husband's hard sword.

Why is music from SKYFALL playing?

Another satelite in DC America falls!!

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Da **** is goin' on?

When did Deadshot borrow Wonder Woman's gauntlets?

"What's the world's ever done for us anyways"? You go girl. Lay on that shade on America's prison system!

The final battle is pointless. She is just toying with them.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Waller, the American bureaucrat, was just laying in hiding to put the criminals (who have provided SERVICE) back in prison. This is brilliant.

Trig being taught to a kid with bullets and guns as metaphors. You can't get more American than that.

I must say, Sam Worthington is great in this as Boomerang. I am enjoying him more than in Avatar.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

I agree, Joel Kinnaman is great as Boomerang

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Done!

Well, it's a bad movie. But I sporadically enjoyed it. I was presented with a simulacrum of fun at places. Which is more than I can say for the hades of an experience that was BvS.

The Deadshot storyline with his daughter almost excited my neurons. Viola Davis gave a good performance. Willie was decent. I came to enjoy Margot at the end. Even Ben showed more emotion in his performance at the end credits than he did in the entirety of BvS.

The Joker's characterization was a disaster. He is not a love sick puppy. Leto was uninspired. He wasn't terrible. But he wasn't good either.

DC's biggest, most frequent problem is the slaughter of their movies in a bid to rush their universe building.

The entirety of the Joker subplot was a mismatched organ to the rest of the film. It doesn't belong. This is a symptom of WB trying to take the shortcut to catch up to Marvel. But the road they are taking is paved with poison that is destroying their films.

As Donald Trump would say, WB, stop it. Stop it. Stop it.

 

[shauner111]

I enjoyed that Tacit hahaha. I watched it recently, and i can't believe i enjoyed it in the cinema so much back in August. Well, the extended cut is actually worse than the theatrical.

Was there a single scene that you liked with Leto or Robbie? Cuz i enjoyed Margot, even the second time around. I think she's perfectly cast. She just needs better dialogue, better characterization here and there.

I got a kick out of Will playing Deadshot. I hope he appears in The Batman. Boomerang still made me laugh on my second viewing, so i hope he's in The Flash (if they ever make it). Waller is a terrible character in this but Viola is Amanda Waller no doubt. Use her in Justice League, if there's no Suicide Squad 2. They say there will be a sequel but i doubt it.

 

[Brother Jack]

I agree, Joel Kinnaman is great as Boomerang

You're thinking of Joel Edgerton.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

I hated her in her first couple of scenes, really terrible line reading. But she got better throughout the film. I liked the scene where she thinks the Joker is dead. Her repartee with Deadshot was good.

Leto was, like I said, uninspired.

His voice is a ripoff of Ledger. His physical acting was cartoonishly over the top. His laugh was awful. He brought nothing new to the table other than that feline purr he would do once in a while.

I have no qualms about Joker being animated in their body language. Both Jack and Heath were. But they also felt at one with the natural world. Leto was trying to be a 2D cartoon.