Decades of Sexual Harassment Accusations Against Harvey Weinstein - Part 2

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The headline says Ben Affleck jokes about sexual harassment. And what he literally does is commit sexual harassment with Gal Gadot right there. Beyond the fishnets comment, he makes light of the situation in Hollywood, even as he has admitted to doing it himself.

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/11/be...ent-joke-justice-league-interview-1201897613/

Sure, but the poster in one of the chosen comments stated "This is where Ben Affleck makes a rape joke" - and I'm assuming it will be taken as such since IndieWire has decided to slant it that way by including that individual's comment.

I'd also hazard, if I wanted to play devil's advocate, that her phrase of "What would you get up to if you had Supergirl on the team?", considering the cataclysmic revelations lately, and Affleck's subsequent sarcasm, could also be read as "You know how that's going to be interpreted?". Affleck should've just continued staring at the floor, but now he's got a new furore to deal with.

I know you won't do this, but somebody else probably will so I'll disclaim this now so long; I'm not defending Affleck's past actions, I condemn them - but I do defend his and every other person's right not to have their bad behavior conflated with the worst behavior because social media pitchfork carriers deem it's fashionable right now.

I mean I'm even seeing people lash out at Gadot for appearing to laugh at the joke (maybe awkward laughter knowing how his statement was going to be interpreted) and now she's on the receiving end of all kinds of vitriol too, honestly seems like all sense has gone.
 
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Sure, but the poster in one of the chosen comments stated "This is where Ben Affleck makes a rape joke" - and I'm assuming it will be taken as such since IndieWire has decided to slant it that way by including that individual's comment.

I'd also hazard, if I wanted to play devil's advocate, that her phrase of "What would you get up to if you had Supergirl on the team?", considering the cataclysmic revelations lately, and Affleck's subsequent sarcasm, could also be read as "You know how that's going to be interpreted?". Affleck should've just continued staring at the floor, but now he's got a new furore to deal with.

I know you won't do this, but somebody else probably will so I'll disclaim this now so long; I'm not defending Affleck's past actions, I condemn them - but I do defend his and every other person's right not to have their bad behavior conflated with the worst behavior because social media pitchfork carriers deem it's fashionable right now.

I mean I'm even seeing people lash out at Gadot for appearing to laugh at the joke (maybe awkward laughter knowing how his statement was going to be interpreted) and now she's on the receiving end of all kinds of vitriol too, honestly seems like all sense has gone.
Can we really say there was sense in the past? You know, when all these horrible things were played off? Give me the overreaction as opposed to none at all. Where sexual harassment, sexual assault and rape were norms people had to deal with.
 
Can we really say there was sense in the past? You know, when all these horrible things were played off? Give me the overreaction as opposed to none at all. Where sexual harassment, sexual assault and rape were norms people had to deal with.

Fair enough, exposing it with exaggerated backlash is preferable to sweeping it all under the carpet.

My wariness is just about this culture of condemnation that's going around, especially when people (like me usually, since I try not to exaggerate unless it's facetiously) who aren't mortally outraged are tacitly accused of victim blaming/victim silencing.

To 'protect my reputation' it paints me into a corner of having to join the hyperbole or be branded a co-conspirator/apologist for rapists and sexual harassers, which is bizarre in all sorts of ways.

My entire sentiment towards this boils down to: If we're going to discuss it it seems like doing it reasonably is advisable, and not boiling everything down to "he's either a rapist or not' or "it's either a rape joke or not" which seems counter-productive.
 
Fair enough, exposing it with exaggerated backlash is preferable to sweeping it all under the carpet.

My wariness is just about this culture of condemnation that's going around, especially when people (like me usually, since I try not to exaggerate unless it's facetiously) who aren't mortally outraged are tacitly accused of victim blaming/victim silencing.

To 'protect my reputation' it paints me into a corner of having to join the hyperbole or be branded a co-conspirator/apologist for rapists and sexual harassers, which is bizarre in all sorts of ways.

My entire sentiment towards this boils down to: If we're going to discuss it it seems like doing it reasonably, and not boiling everything down to "he's either a rapist or not' or "it's either a rape joke or not" seems counter-productive.
I get your point. It is a fair point. As always, context matters, and I think Affleck has lost the benefit of the doubt in this situation. Especially with how close he is to this whole situation. Beyond admitting to sexual assault and being accused of more. Beyond his working relationship with Weinstein and his apparent knowledge that he raped Rose McGowan and did something else before that. Beyond his brother. This is a time and place where anyone with a brain cell while dealing with the press should understand you can't even give the hint you are kidding about this. Its too raw, its too serious. And when guys make light of this, it is far too close to what the problem was in the first place.
 
Can we really say there was sense in the past? You know, when all these horrible things were played off? Give me the overreaction as opposed to none at all. Where sexual harassment, sexual assault and rape were norms people had to deal with.

I think there's a big difference between making a comment about liking fishnets and physically raping someone. That indiewire article you provided didn't even have the actual video interview. I think you're kind of grasping at straws here.
 
I think there's a big difference between making a comment about liking fishnets and physically raping someone. That indiewire article you provided didn't even have the actual video interview. I think you're kind of grasping at straws here.
I didn't post the article. I just used it after the original post. Are we going to act like Affleck isn't an admitted sexual assaulter? One who boiled down the need for a character's inclusion to her sex appeal after the one who brought up the character emphasized other things?

Here is the clip. It does not help the argument it wasn't a "bad joke" imo. Even he cringes after saying it. I think he knows he shouldn't have said it and probably immediately regretted it.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...league-press-tour_us_5a0b5fcce4b0b17ffce0f5e9
 
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I get the reasoning behind your outrage, but I'm failing to muster any myself.
 
The Old Vic Reveals 20 Allegations Against Kevin Spacey

The Old Vic Theatre has received 20 allegations of inappropriate behavior by Kevin Spacey during his 11-year run as artistic director. The London theater admitted that there was a “cult of personality” around the Swimming With Sharks star and that his “stardom” and “status” may have prevented people, in particular junior staff or young actors, from feeling that they could speak up.

The theater released the results of its investigation, run by law firm Lewis Silkin, after launching an anonymous hotline last month to allow staff and actors to speak out.

It found that 16 staff and four others came forward with a number of allegations against Spacey between 1995 and 2013.

It added that the majority of the allegations happened before 2009. However, the Waterloo theater revealed that no “legal claims, formal grievances, formal disputes, settlement agreements or payments” were made in relation to Spacey during this period.

The Old Vic noted that in all but one case, these individuals alleging inappropriate behavior did not come forward at the time or asked that no formal action be taken.

“During his tenure, The Old Vic was in a unique position of having a Hollywood star at the helm around whom existed a cult of personality. The investigation found that his stardom and status at The Old Vic may have prevented people, and in particular junior staff or young actors, from feeling that they could speak up or raise a hand for help,” it noted in a statement.

Current Artistic Director Matthew Warchus said the allegations were a “shock and a disturbing surprise to many of us”.

“I have genuine and deep sympathy for all those who have come forward and said they were hurt in some way by my predecessor’s actions. Everyone is entitled to work in an environment free from harassment and intimidation. The Old Vic is now actively engaged in the process of healing and the process of prevention.

“It is incorrect, unfair and irresponsible to say that everybody knew. But as a result of the investigation, what we have learnt is how better to call out this behaviour in future.

“These findings will help not only The Old Vic but our industry as a whole, as together we rapidly evolve an intelligent new standard of protection and support in and around the workplace. We are committed to a new way forward.”

The Old Vic Chairman Nick Clarry apologized to the victims. “Inappropriate behavior by anyone working at The Old Vic is completely unacceptable. We will foster a safe and supportive environment without prejudice, harassment or bullying of any sort, at any level. We want anyone who works here to feel confident, valued and proud to be part of The Old Vic family,” he added.
 
Al Franken

By Leeann Tweeden

In December of 2006, I embarked on my ninth USO Tour to entertain our troops, my eighth to the Middle East since the 9/11 attacks. My father served in Vietnam and my then-boyfriend (and now husband, Chris) is a pilot in the Air Force, so bringing a ‘little piece of home’ to servicemembers stationed far away from their families was both my passion and my privilege.

Also on the trip were country music artists Darryl Worley, Mark Wills, Keni Thomas, and some cheerleaders from the Dallas Cowboys. The headliner was comedian and now-senator, Al Franken.

Franken had written some skits for the show and brought props and costumes to go along with them. Like many USO shows before and since, the skits were full of sexual innuendo geared toward a young, male audience.

As a TV host and sports broadcaster, as well as a model familiar to the audience from the covers of FHM, Maxim and Playboy, I was only expecting to emcee and introduce the acts, but Franken said he had written a part for me that he thought would be funny, and I agreed to play along.

When I saw the script, Franken had written a moment when his character comes at me for a ‘kiss’. I suspected what he was after, but I figured I could turn my head at the last minute, or put my hand over his mouth, to get more laughs from the crowd.

On the day of the show Franken and I were alone backstage going over our lines one last time. He said to me, “We need to rehearse the kiss.” I laughed and ignored him. Then he said it again. I said something like, ‘Relax Al, this isn’t SNL…we don’t need to rehearse the kiss.’

He continued to insist, and I was beginning to get uncomfortable.

He repeated that actors really need to rehearse everything and that we must practice the kiss. I said ‘OK’ so he would stop badgering me. We did the line leading up to the kiss and then he came at me, put his hand on the back of my head, mashed his lips against mine and aggressively stuck his tongue in my mouth.

I immediately pushed him away with both of my hands against his chest and told him if he ever did that to me again I wouldn’t be so nice about it the next time.

I walked away. All I could think about was getting to a bathroom as fast as possible to rinse the taste of him out of my mouth.

I felt disgusted and violated.

Not long after, I performed the skit as written, carefully turning my head so he couldn’t kiss me on the lips.

No one saw what happened backstage. I didn’t tell the Sergeant Major of the Army, who was the sponsor of the tour. I didn’t tell our USO rep what happened.

At the time I didn’t want to cause trouble. We were in the middle of a war zone, it was the first show of our Holiday tour, I was a professional, and I could take care of myself. I told a few of the others on the tour what Franken had done and they knew how I felt about it.

I tried to let it go, but I was angry.

Other than our dialogue on stage, I never had a voluntary conversation with Al Franken again. I avoided him as much as possible and made sure I was never alone with him again for the rest of the tour.

Franken repaid me with petty insults, including drawing devil horns on at least one of the headshots I was autographing for the troops.

But he didn’t stop there.

The tour wrapped and on Christmas Eve we began the 36-hour trip home to L.A. After 2 weeks of grueling travel and performing I was exhausted. When our C-17 cargo plane took off from Afghanistan I immediately fell asleep, even though I was still wearing my flak vest and Kevlar helmet.

It wasn’t until I was back in the US and looking through the CD of photos we were given by the photographer that I saw this one:

HJPuZYi.jpg


I couldn’t believe it. He groped me, without my consent, while I was asleep.

I felt violated all over again. Embarrassed. Belittled. Humiliated.

How dare anyone grab my breasts like this and think it’s funny?

I told my husband everything that happened and showed him the picture.

I wanted to shout my story to the world with a megaphone to anyone who would listen, but even as angry as I was, I was worried about the potential backlash and damage going public might have on my career as a broadcaster.

But that was then, this is now. I’m no longer afraid.

Today, I am the news anchor on McIntyre in the Morning on KABC Radio in Los Angeles. My colleagues are some of the most supportive people I’ve ever worked with in my career. Like everyone in the media, we’ve been reporting on the Harvey Weinstein sexual misconduct allegations since they broke, and the flood of similar stories that have come out about others.

A few weeks ago, we had California Congresswoman Jackie Speier on the show and she told us her story of being sexually assaulted when she was a young Congressional aide. She described how a powerful man in the office where she worked ‘held her face, kissed her and stuck his tongue in her mouth.’

At that moment, I thought to myself, Al Franken did that exact same thing to me.

I had locked up those memories of helplessness and violation for a long time, but they all came rushing back to me and my hands clinched into fists like it was yesterday.

I’m still angry at what Al Franken did to me.

Every time I hear his voice or see his face, I am angry. I am angry that I did his stupid skit for the rest of that tour. I am angry that I didn’t call him out in front of everyone when I had the microphone in my hand every night after that. I wanted to. But I didn’t want to rock the boat. I was there to entertain the troops and make sure they forgot about where they were for a few hours. Someday, I thought to myself, I would tell my story.

That day is now.

Senator Franken, you wrote the script. But there’s nothing funny about sexual assault.

You wrote the scene that would include you kissing me and then relentlessly badgered me into ‘rehearsing’ the kiss with you backstage when we were alone.

You knew exactly what you were doing. You forcibly kissed me without my consent, grabbed my breasts while I was sleeping and had someone take a photo of you doing it, knowing I would see it later, and be ashamed.

While debating whether or not to go public, I even thought to myself, so much worse has happened to so many others, maybe my story isn’t worth telling? But my story is worth telling.

Not just because 2017 is not 2006, or because I am much more secure in my career now than I was then, and not because I’m still angry.

I’m telling my story because there may be others.

I want to have the same effect on them that Congresswoman Jackie Speier had on me. I want them, and all the other victims of sexual assault, to be able to speak out immediately, and not keep their stories –and their anger– locked up inside for years, or decades.

I want the days of silence to be over forever.
 
I was wondering why Al Franken was suddenly trending on Twitter.
 
Geeze Louise......is it going to be easier to announce who HASN'T sexually assaulted women?
 
Thanks a lot Al. ****ing hell...

Just give the "What aboutism" idiots some ammo.

What is the attraction to making these male dominance fantasies come to life? What is sexy of gratifying about seeing a woman look at you indisgust as you force yourself on them?
 
Well, ****. I guess we're all creeps then. As a guy, I can admit that we as dudes have always been confused when it comes to women in regards to what's ok to do and what not when it's a gray area. I can even recall in high school asking a girl if she wanted to go see a movie and I was told by one of her girls that I came off as too creepy when asking. But when it comes to blatant harrassment or assault, yeah.
 
Maybe we should make a list of who ISN'T a creep. It would be shorter. :(
 
A lot of your favorites will be taken down. And that is a good thing.
 
Hugh Jackman, Taylor Kitsch, Chris Pratt...these are names I'd better not see on the naughty list. :(
 
I really don't get how men get into a state of mind in doing this, and it's not a straight vs. gay thing, as I'm equally flummoxed by Kevin Spacey and George Takei's stuff.

I don't drink or do drugs, never have, so I'm wondering if that ever plays a role in what turns these men into beasts.
 
Stallone is the next one ... It really says some nasty stuff in the dailymail article, but you can all find it in Google ... Just type Stallone 16 years old fan
 
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