The Avengers The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 2

[cherokeesam]

Nope, it's pretty obvious that Fox does own the rights to Adamantium since they've mentioned the metal in almost every X-movie and Wolverine's made with the stuff. Adamantium is apart of the X-Men deal for them. Same reason why Cap's shield is only composed of Vibranium in the movies and not a Adamantium/Vibranium hybrid. I can guarantee you that you won't be hearing about Adamantium in the MCU anytime soon, unless Marvel miraculously gets those X-Men film rights back.

Adamantium is not exclusive to the X-Men in Marvel Comics, and there's no reason to assume that Fox was able to secure some kind of trademark on it for the X-Men film rights. Adamantium is part of the mythos of many Marvel titles, not just ones with an X prefix. Just because Marvel Studios hasn't mentioned it yet doesn't mean they won't.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

Adamantium is not exclusive to the X-Men in Marvel Comics, and there's no reason to assume that Fox was able to secure some kind of trademark on it for the X-Men film rights. Adamantium is part of the mythos of many Marvel titles, not just ones with an X prefix. Just because Marvel Studios hasn't mentioned it yet doesn't mean they won't.

They won't. It isn't exclusive just to the X-Men in the comics but since Fox bought the franchise years ago and opted to use Vibranium in their first movie, they got the movie rights to it early and this prevents Marvel from being able to use it in their films. In the comics a lot of things intertwine and connect, but unfortunately it can't be that way in the movies because of rights. Also, pretty much anyone in the GA who's watched an X-movie knows that Wolverine is made of Adamantium and if Marvel used it some people might recognize the name and try to connect the Avengers to X-Men(which we know isn't possible). It's like how the MCU can include the Skrulls, but they're not allowed to use Super-Skrull because Fox owns the rights.

 

[Tissues]

the iron man 2 special features has pictures of cap's shield blue prints and there's a little note on it about an adamantium alloy.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

the iron man 2 special features has pictures of cap's shield blue prints and there's a little note on it about an adamantium alloy.

I heard about that a while ago as well but since I don't own IM2 I've never been able to verify it. A little note on special features found in the SHIELD vault is a lot different than having the metal mentioned or used in a movie, though.

 

[Xeno]

It only makes sense that SHIELD would have one of its assassins equipped with a weapon that can take down Hulk. Fury isn't one to leave that to chance. A vibranium/adamantium-tipped arrow works well enough in that regard. The movies simply cannot depict characters with the insane levels of power they have in the comics, so Hulk is going to have vulnerabilities.

 

[cherokeesam]

They won't. It isn't exclusive just to the X-Men in the comics but since Fox bought the franchise years ago and opted to use Vibranium in their first movie, they got the movie rights to it early and this prevents Marvel from being able to use it in their films. In the comics a lot of things intertwine and connect, but unfortunately it can't be that way in the movies because of rights. Also, pretty much anyone in the GA who's watched an X-movie knows that Wolverine is made of Adamantium and if Marvel used it some people might recognize the name and try to connect the Avengers to X-Men(which we know isn't possible). It's like how the MCU can include the Skrulls, but they're not allowed to use Super-Skrull because Fox owns the rights.

And you have proof of this, where?

Are you saying that just because X-Men movies mention adamantium that they suddenly have exclusive rights over that word? Maybe they've got exclusive rights over the words "Blackbird" and "Brotherhood" and "Wolverine" now, too (take THAT, University of Michigan).

Unless and until you can show some kind of credit at the end of the X-films that says "the name 'adamantium' is exclusive to Fox Studios," then you're just fanboy speculating 'n' postulating.

Again, adamantium is part of the LARGER Marvel Universe, not just Wolverine's skeleton; and anyone watching Marvel films damn well knows that and is not going to be getting all confused if other films suddenly mention that Cap's shield has elements of adamantium, or that Hammerhead's cranium or Bullseye's skeleton are made of the stuff, or that Ultron's casing is adamantium, etc.

 

[terry78]

So Fox Studios has the rights to a fictional metal created in a comic book? Everyday the world turns into a Simpsons episode.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

And you have proof of this, where?

Are you saying that just because X-Men movies mention adamantium that they suddenly have exclusive rights over that word? Maybe they've got exclusive rights over the words "Blackbird" and "Brotherhood" and "Wolverine" now, too (take THAT, University of Michigan).

Unless and until you can show some kind of credit at the end of the X-films that says "the name 'adamantium' is exclusive to Fox Studios," then you're just fanboy speculating 'n' postulating.

Again, adamantium is part of the LARGER Marvel Universe, not just Wolverine's skeleton; and anyone watching Marvel films damn well knows that and is not going to be getting all confused if other films suddenly mention that Cap's shield has elements of adamantium, or that Hammerhead's cranium or Bullseye's skeleton are made of the stuff, or that Ultron's casing is adamantium, etc.

Anyone watching Marvel films? Most of those watching these films just do it for the entertainment and don't read the comics. I can think of a lot of people that try to connect the films together if Adamantium was mentioned. But, you obviously have an opinion that you've chosen to stick to just like I have. Guess we'll both have to wait and see, then.

 

[FrostBite]

This is a really, really, really silly debate in the grand scheme of things. Why is Hulk on the team? Why is Hawkeye? Why is Black Widow? Because she can speak latin and he fires arrows? Is it because they are super-limber? Why is Cap? Because he's got a good heart and punches super-hard? Dudes. You have a super genius who builds freaking mech suits that are basically walking atom bombs. You have a thunder God who created tornadoes, and bust through the back of a giant's skull.

You need one of these things to take down an army. Heck, Thor, Iron Man, Captain, and Hulk already DID take down armies in each of their respective flicks.

This "I'm a super-nerd who needs to be proven the imaginary limits of a superhero's capable strength because if I don't get an exact figure I am going to crap myself in a four year old style temper tantrum" debate is probably the most ludicrous complaint anyone could have with the quality of these films. Then again, fans are... "fanatics," so, I guess it's to be expected. I'm also not knocking anyone to be clear, I am just not sure why it should matter. At all.

Still, I do think it is obvious Hulk is going to be the macho man in terms of strength in the flick. He's going to be fighting the entire team, we know this much, and he's not just going to kneel down and take it like a whimpy baby. Did he seem de-powered to some compared to his comic book self? Sure. Was he more grounded? I don't know. He went up against a Captain America knock-off and turned his bones to brittle dust with a swift kick after being provoked. For all we know, ol' Jadejaws could have been holding back with the military (which is all he was given to fight,) and with Abomination being stronger to begin with, Hulk clearly goes from eye-rolls and stumbling around after having his butt handed to him, to an aggressive monster who rips out his opponents bones to use as a make-shift shiv in an attempt to murder him and creates sonic blasts with his hands.

As for a mention on why a thunderclap wouldn't have sent the copter flying/the smash crumbling the roof? ...Did we forget Betty was there? You know, the only object of affection and care for our Mr. Hyde? You think he wants to kill her just to get to A-Bomb?

All of it made sense for the flick. And I liked it, that finale is one of the best in the MCU for me.

It might be more fun to "test" the big guy just like Tony is reportedly doing out of curiosity and see where his limits can go. To back up November Rain slightly, he doesn't make sense to be part of the team.

On the other hand, I believe that for a different reason. He's an uncontrollable liability. Anyone else can hold back, anyone else reacts when they are hurt, they flinch, they stumble--Hulk doesn't. Banner would obviously love the opportunity to belong, but Hulk a is dangerous wild card of to which know one seems to know his limits outside of the opportunity of sedating him (which is likely easier said than done.) And personally, I cannot wait to see where they go with that.

Edit: With the adamantium thing, yes, it's probably covered under Fox's agreement. Not in terms of "THEY OWN THE WORD," but in terms of that word being specifically applied to a unique metal with that name which is impervious. If a movie comes out that takes place in a quarantine where everybody is suffering from "Blood Blackening Virus" (or some such nonsense) that has a specific idea behind it and a second movie comes out with that exact same concept and name... they can, and likely will be sued.

It isn't a matter of "But it's Marvel's baby!" No, they gave this baby away until said baby has had it's full course at another company and is nearly beaten to death before it can return to it's original mother. They take that baby and they are kidnappers. ...This analogy got weird.

There is a reason they went with Vibranium already. Adamantium is more well known among the GA due to the success of the X-films. If you think Marvel wouldn't have capitalized on that for the strange purpose of wanting two super strong unbreakable metals in their continuity, then I don't know what you'll be willing to believe.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

This is a really, really, really silly debate in the grand scheme of things. Why is Hulk on the team? Why is Hawkeye? Why is Black Widow? Because she can speak latin and he fires arrows? Is it because they are super-limber? Why is Cap? Because he's got a good heart and punches super-hard? Dudes. You have a super genius who builds freaking mech suits that are basically walking atom bombs. You have a thunder God who created tornadoes, and bust through the back of a giant's skull.

You need one of these things to take down an army. Heck, Thor, Iron Man, Captain, and Hulk already DID take down armies in each of their respective flicks.

This "I'm a super-nerd who needs to be proven the imaginary limits of a superhero's capable strength because if I don't get an exact figure I am going to crap myself in a four year old style temper tantrum" debate is probably the most ludicrous complaint anyone could have with the quality of these films. Then again, fans are... "fanatics," so, I guess it's to be expected. I'm also not knocking anyone to be clear, I am just not sure why it should matter. At all.

Still, I do think it is obvious Hulk is going to be the macho man in terms of strength in the flick. He's going to be fighting the entire team, we know this much, and he's not just going to kneel down and take it like a whimpy baby. Did he seem de-powered to some compared to his comic book self? Sure. Was he more grounded? I don't know. He went up against a Captain America knock-off and turned his bones to brittle dust with a swift kick after being provoked. For all we know, ol' Jadejaws could have been holding back with the military (which is all he was given to fight,) and with Abomination being stronger to begin with, Hulk clearly goes from eye-rolls and stumbling around after having his butt handed to him, to an aggressive monster who rips out his opponents bones to use as a make-shift shiv in an attempt to murder him and creates sonic blasts with his hands.

As for a mention on why a thunderclap wouldn't have sent the copter flying/the smash crumbling the roof? ...Did we forget Betty was there? You know, the only object of affection and care for our Mr. Hyde? You think he wants to kill her just to get to A-Bomb?

All of it made sense for the flick. And I liked it, that finale is one of the best in the MCU for me.

It might be more fun to "test" the big guy just like Tony is reportedly doing out of curiosity and see where his limits can go. To back up November Rain slightly, he doesn't make sense to be part of the team.

On the other hand, I believe that for a different reason. He's an uncontrollable liability. Anyone else can hold back, anyone else reacts when they are hurt, they flinch, they stumble--Hulk doesn't. Banner would obviously love the opportunity to belong, but Hulk a is dangerous wild card of to which know one seems to know his limits outside of the opportunity of sedating him (which is likely easier said than done.) And personally, I cannot wait to see where they go with that.

Edit: With the adamantium thing, yes, it's probably covered under Fox's agreement. Not in terms of "THEY OWN THE WORD," but in terms of that word being specifically applied to a unique metal with that name which is impervious. If a movie comes out that takes place in a quarantine where everybody is suffering from "Blood Blackening Virus" (or some such nonsense) that has a specific idea behind it and a second movie comes out with that exact same concept and name... they can, and likely will be sued.

It isn't a matter of "But it's Marvel's baby!" No, they gave this baby away until said baby has had it's full course at another company and is nearly beaten to death before it can return to it's original mother. They take that baby and they are kidnappers. ...This analogy got weird.

There is a reason they went with Vibranium already. Adamantium is more well known among the GA due to the success of the X-films. If you think Marvel wouldn't have capitalized on that for the strange purpose of wanting two super strong unbreakable metals in their continuity, then I don't know what you'll be willing to believe.

Well said.

 

[cherokeesam]

Edit: With the adamantium thing, yes, it's probably covered under Fox's agreement. Not in terms of "THEY OWN THE WORD," but in terms of that word being specifically applied to a unique metal with that name which is impervious. If a movie comes out that takes place in a quarantine where everybody is suffering from "Blood Blackening Virus" (or some such nonsense) that has a specific idea behind it and a second movie comes out with that exact same concept and name... they can, and likely will be sued.

It isn't a matter of "But it's Marvel's baby!" No, they gave this baby away until said baby has had it's full course at another company and is nearly beaten to death before it can return to it's original mother. They take that baby and they are kidnappers. ...This analogy got weird.

There is a reason they went with Vibranium already. Adamantium is more well known among the GA due to the success of the X-films. If you think Marvel wouldn't have capitalized on that for the strange purpose of wanting two super strong unbreakable metals in their continuity, then I don't know what you'll be willing to believe.

You act (like most fanboys on this forum) like Marvel Studios is in *competition* with Fox. (And Sony. And Lionsgate. Whoever else.)

Here's a cold hard fact: Marvel profits from ALL of their comic book film properties. Regardless of whether or not the film was made by Fox, Sony, or the in-house team.

There's not a trademark on "adamantium" in the X-movies. If Marvel decides to say that Cap's new shield in the Avengers is made of adamantium, it doesn't hurt Fox one bit.

The *only* reason that the shield is made of vibranium in CA:TFA instead of adamantium is that's the frickin' way it was in the frickin' comics. The inventor, Dr. Myron McClain, made the shield out of vibranium and some other alloy that he could never recall, so the material was an accident. DECADES later, when he was working for SHIELD, McClain tried to recreate the process and (again accidentally) invented adamantium.

There is no reason at all to believe that adamantium won't appear in the MFU, most likely in Cap's modern shield, and every reason to believe that Marvel Studios will continue to remain faithful to the source material by making Cap's new shield out of (say it with me)....adamantium.

And then we can put you guys and your ridiculous "Fox really *does* ruin everything" conspiracy theories to bed.

 

[BigThor]

I always thought Cap's modern shield was made out of vibranium as well, you learn something new everyday.

 

[cherokeesam]

I always thought Cap's modern shield was made out of vibranium as well, you learn something new everyday.

Ultimate Cap's shield is made of adamantium, and Movie Cap is modeled more closely after Ult Cap than 616.

616 Cap's shield (modern) is a mixture of vibranium and adamantium.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

You act (like most fanboys on this forum) like Marvel Studios is in *competition* with Fox. (And Sony. And Lionsgate. Whoever else.)

Here's a cold hard fact: Marvel profits from ALL of their comic book film properties. Regardless of whether or not the film was made by Fox, Sony, or the in-house team.

There's not a trademark on "adamantium" in the X-movies. If Marvel decides to say that Cap's new shield in the Avengers is made of adamantium, it doesn't hurt Fox one bit.

The *only* reason that the shield is made of vibranium in CA:TFA instead of adamantium is that's the frickin' way it was in the frickin' comics. The inventor, Dr. Myron McClain, made the shield out of vibranium and some other alloy that he could never recall, so the material was an accident. DECADES later, when he was working for SHIELD, McClain tried to recreate the process and (again accidentally) invented adamantium.

There is no reason at all to believe that adamantium won't appear in the MFU, most likely in Cap's modern shield, and every reason to believe that Marvel Studios will continue to remain faithful to the source material by making Cap's new shield out of (say it with me)....adamantium.

And then we can put you guys and your ridiculous "Fox really *does* ruin everything" conspiracy theories to bed.

Conspiracy theories, really? I don't have a chip on my shoulder with Fox at all, I think it's a solid studio. However, I do think that Fox would have a problem if Marvel chose to use Adamantium in their films. Disagree with me? Fine, go ahead. I'm not going to argue with you about something that hasn't been revealed yet(probably won't, though). Earlier, you asked me for proof on how I knew that Adamantium couldn't be used. You seem very sure, so where's your proof that it can/will be used? Not continuing the useless debate, just genuinely curious.

 

[cherokeesam]

Conspiracy theories, really? I don't have a chip on my shoulder with Fox at all, I think it's a solid studio. However, I do think that Fox would have a problem if Marvel chose to use Adamantium in their films. Disagree with me? Fine, go ahead. I'm not going to argue with you about something that hasn't been revealed yet(probably won't, though). Earlier, you asked me for proof on how I knew that Adamantium couldn't be used. You seem very sure, so where's your proof that it can/will be used? Not continuing the useless debate, just genuinely curious.

The burden of proof is on *you,* my friend. You're the one who's asserting that because Marvel Studios hasn't mentioned adamantium *yet,* that's somehow "proof" that they can't mention it. Ergo: conspiracy theory.

As for "proof" on my end:

1) as mentioned above, "adamantium" is *already* specifically listed as a component of Cap's shield in the IM2 DVD special features (which would be a violation of whatever exclusivity contract you're imagining that Fox has over the word), and

2) as *I* mentioned above, Marvel Studios will very likely continue to follow comic-book canon and have the *new* modern shield made out of vibranium *and* adamantium.

 

[wobbly]

Ultimate Cap's shield is made of adamantium, and Movie Cap is modeled more closely after Ult Cap than 616.

616 Cap's shield (modern) is a mixture of vibranium and adamantium.

Not quite. The 616 Shield is made from Vibranium and an unknown alloy (the unknown part is what makes it indestructible, with the impact/kinetic force absorption coming from the Vibranium).

In fact, in the 616 world Adamantium was invented in an attempt to recreate Cap's shield (made it's first appearance in the Avengers books, long before Wolverine ever turned up).

In regards whether Marvel could use the term or not...I would think they can: The word, and it's usage to describe something unbreakable, is derived from 'Adamantine' which is thousands of years old. All they need do is stick to the books for its origins, rather than the meteor found in Africa thing (which is pretty much the Vibranium deal) that they went for over at Fox.

 

[irapogi]

as much as this debate's pretty interesting, i was hoping to see hulk talk in the hulk board lol.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

The burden of proof is on *you,* my friend. You're the one who's asserting that because Marvel Studios hasn't mentioned adamantium *yet,* that's somehow "proof" that they can't mention it. Ergo: conspiracy theory.

As for "proof" on my end:

1) as mentioned above, "adamantium" is *already* specifically listed as a component of Cap's shield in the IM2 DVD special features (which would be a violation of whatever exclusivity contract you're imagining that Fox has over the word), and

2) as *I* mentioned above, Marvel Studios will very likely continue to follow comic-book canon and have the *new* modern shield made out of vibranium *and* adamantium.

The "burden of proof" doesn't just fall on me, because if you're asking for it then you should also have some legitimate proof to back up your opinion. Right now, I have no proof so I chose to just wait and see. However, you continue to make these claims like it's a certainty that it'll be in the movie. Me asserting my claims isn't any different than you asserting yours.

1) Adamantium is mentioned as a metal on the notes in the SHIELD Vault on IM2. Having it on a movie menu's special features is a lot different than having it upfront in a movie where it's outright mentioned or used by a character. Also, it wasn't meant to be a component of the Shield Cap uses in his movie, it's a component of the half-made shield that was in IM2 as a gag.There's still no proof that it'll be Cap's shield in The Avengers. From what we know and have seen so far, his Vibranium shield from his movie is still intact.

2) You said they'll very likely continue to follow comic-book canon, but how is that proof at all? You're still continuing to say what you think is right and what you think is going to happen because of comic-book canon. The MCU is a seperate universe from the 616/Ultimate so they do not have to follow specific canon. There's no guarantee or proof that your claims are correct.

How is the MCU Cap modeled more closely after Ultimate Cap than 616 Cap other than his looks?I thought personality/origin was more closer to 616 than Ultimate. This isn't getting anywhere.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

as much as this debate's pretty interesting, i was hoping to see hulk talk in the hulk board lol.

Sorry about this!

 

[Quasimod0]

I dont think marvel studios can mention adamantium, its probably owned by fox

 

[cherokeesam]

The "burden of proof" doesn't just fall on me, because if you're asking for it then you should also have some legitimate proof to back up your opinion. Right now, I have no proof so I chose to just wait and see. However, you continue to make these claims like it's a certainty that it'll be in the movie. Me asserting my claims isn't any different than you asserting yours.

1) Adamantium is mentioned as a metal on the notes in the SHIELD Vault on IM2. Having it on a movie menu's special features is a lot different than having it upfront in a movie where it's outright mentioned or used by a character. Also, it wasn't meant to be a component of the Shield Cap uses in his movie, it's a component of the half-made shield that was in IM2 as a gag.There's still no proof that it'll be Cap's shield in The Avengers. From what we know and have seen so far, his Vibranium shield from his movie is still intact.

2) You said they'll very likely continue to follow comic-book canon, but how is that proof at all? You're still continuing to say what you think is right and what you think is going to happen because of comic-book canon. The MCU is a seperate universe from the 616/Ultimate so they do not have to follow specific canon. There's no guarantee or proof that your claims are correct.

How is the MCU Cap modeled more closely after Ultimate Cap than 616 Cap other than his looks?I thought personality/origin was more closer to 616 than Ultimate. This isn't getting anywhere.

I never said it was a "certainty" that it would be in the Avengers movie. Just that it was *likely* to be used, since they seem to be following canon on the evolution of Cap's shield so far.

All I was saying is that *you* state that Fox "owns" adamantium rights with some sort of false certainty, and there's absolutely no proof towards that anywhere beyond your own assumption.

as much as this debate's pretty interesting, i was hoping to see hulk talk in the hulk board lol.

Okay....I sure hope we get to see Cap use his adamantium shield against Hulk in the fight to bring Jadejaws into the Avengers.

I dont think marvel studios can mention adamantium, its probably owned by fox

arrrrrrgggghhhhhh (last three pages)

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

I never said it was a "certainty" that it would be in the Avengers movie. Just that it was *likely* to be used, since they seem to be following canon on the evolution of Cap's shield so far.

All I was saying is that *you* state that Fox "owns" adamantium rights with some sort of false certainty, and there's absolutely no proof towards that anywhere beyond your own assumption.



Okay....I sure hope we get to see Cap use his adamantium shield against Hulk in the fight to bring Jadejaws into the Avengers.



arrrrrrgggghhhhhh (last three pages)

I guess we'll see who's correct in The Avengers next year, then.

 

[ArtTeacher]

Not happy about the prospect of Hawkeye taking Hulk down with tranq-darts, if bulletts and grenades cant pierce his skin how the hell will an arrow?

Agreed. The general audience (i.e., the majority of the people that see the film) aren't going to delineate the fine differences between steel and vibranium-tipped (or even Adamantium) arrows, all they're going to see is that a bow & arrow just took out the Hulk. For years, you'll hear things like, "So what, he can lift a tank, all I need is my cousin's crossbow and I can take down the Hulk," or "Geez, if an arrow can do that to him, imagine what a shotgun or tank-fire can do to him!"

Thing is...... within a two hour or so film are we gonna see a Hulk that is, on the one hand controllable by Hawkeye's arrows, but also capable of kicking the holy bajeebus out of Loki's army. Just seems a bit inconsistent.

Exactly.

I strongly, *strongly* doubt that Renner is on target (heh) when he believes that his arrow is the "only" thing that can take Hulk down.

To me, the big deal is not that it's the "only" thing that can take down the Hulk, it's that an arrow is able to take down the Hulk, at all.

I'm not strictly thinking that the arrow will penetrate Hulk's skin, but maybe it explodes with a tranquilizing gas that Hulk will inhale......

If I have to watch an arrow stop the Hulk, I would much rather it be this than something actually pierce his skin.

I realize that this is mostly conjecture, based on Renner's statements in an interview and that we have no way of knowing the context of the arrows, etc. However, I'm not liking the idea of an arrow piercing the Hulk's skin.

 

[BigThor]

as much as this debate's pretty interesting, i was hoping to see hulk talk in the hulk board lol.

Agreed

Agreed. The general audience (i.e., the majority of the people that see the film) aren't going to delineate the fine differences between steel and vibranium-tipped (or even Adamantium) arrows, all they're going to see is that a bow & arrow just took out the Hulk. For years, you'll hear things like, "So what, he can lift a tank, all I need is my cousin's crossbow and I can take down the Hulk," or "Geez, if an arrow can do that to him, imagine what a shotgun or tank-fire can do to him!

To me, the big deal is not that it's the "only" thing that can take down the Hulk, it's that an arrow is able to take down the Hulk, at all.

If I have to watch an arrow stop the Hulk, I would much rather it be this than something actually pierce his skin.

I realize that this is mostly conjecture, based on Renner's statements in an interview and that we have no way of knowing the context of the arrows, etc. However, I'm not liking the idea of an arrow piercing the Hulk's skin.

I agree with this as well t:

 

[LOBO3315a]

Hulk has been gassed before. Makes sense for Hawkeye to have an arrow that detonates on contact, and it sprays a gas that knocks Hulk out.

I wouldn't hate that. But an arrow (even a vibranuim/adamantium one) wouldn't hurt Hulk much. Even if it is tipped with a drug. The whole arrow would have to be a hypodermic for it to have any effect.