The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 24

[Dark Raven]

I can't really see a problem with Disney using Daredevil, Iron Fist etc. in films or streaming series without any real 'reboot'.

Matt Murdock is a blind lawyer who practices law with his friend Foggy Nelson. His father was a boxer who died when he was young, and now he takes on the persona of masked vigilante "Daredevil" to fight crime in his neighborhood of Hells Kitchen etc. etc. etc.

Danny Rand is a wealthy businessman who gained the power of "The Imortal Iron Fist" after studying in K'un L'n and defeating the dragon Shou-Lao etc. etc. etc.

Marvel could easily drop new actors into the roles and use them however they want in the future, and I don't see how the Netflix series would limit them in any meaningful way.

It's just like in the comics, different artists and writers have slightly different takes. The characters shift and evolve over time, but readers are, and should be forgiving enough that they won't say: "Hey! That can't happen because in issue 125 on page 12 in the 4th panel, the character said "XXXX".

If Marvel is going to be making films and TV shows for the next 30 years, they need to pin themselves, to some extent, to the comic books and films that have come before, but we need to give them reasonable wiggle room to continue to create and tell new stories.

Well with Daredevil, they have an easy way out. The show is told from his point of view. They can say that he's blind and doesn't know exactly what he looks like. And it might turn out that the show was his own idea of what he thought he looked like, but he actually looks a bit different - hence the film interpretation.

 

[Iceman]

Well, isn't that interesting. It's clear that Marvel knows Iron Fist has movie potential.

Yep, good to see.

 

[Shuri]

Marvel should recast Danny and Luke and I'm game for another shot at these characters.

 

[Darkprime]

The only one I dont want recast is Daredevil. But if Cox for whatever reason didnt want to crossover or return then theyd have no choice.

 

[Detective Conan]

Charlie Cox being recast is almost inconceivable to me. He’s to Daredevil like RDJ is to Iron Man imo.

 

[Marvel united]

Disney are not distancing themselves from the shows. Netflix it's. They're the ones with say on if they're cancelled or not. Whether it was 5 years ago doesn't matter. If they had faith in them add movies, they would have been movies. Period.

That does not mean Feige did not have faith in them as movies. He just had no plans for them at the time. Things can change, plans can be altered. Feige may have a vision for where these characters can fit in the MCU now. Especially with New Avengers on the horizon.

Disney doing actual MCU shows on Disney+ that are connected is a clear sigh the Netflix shows are not canon. I think it's time for people to accept the fact that the Netlfix shows exist in their own pocket universe.

 

[babykhris]

If Marvel did reboot Iron Fist, they could have him feature alongside all the other Marvel heroes like in this Marvel Universe Live Disney event.

Here Iron Fist is in full costume next to everyone else.

Marvel Universe LIVE! | Book tickets direct with Disney UK - Disney UK

Now of course, it might not be quite movie level, but it still looks pretty good. Most of the costumes are based on the Marvel movies.

It's funny they picked him out of all the Netflix characters. They didn't have DD or Luke Cage there. But here, Iron Fist looks like a full and proper superhero.

I can't really see a problem with Disney using Daredevil, Iron Fist etc. in films or streaming series without any real 'reboot'.

Matt Murdock is a blind lawyer who practices law with his friend Foggy Nelson. His father was a boxer who died when he was young, and now he takes on the persona of masked vigilante "Daredevil" to fight crime in his neighborhood of Hells Kitchen etc. etc. etc.

Danny Rand is a wealthy businessman who gained the power of "The Imortal Iron Fist" after studying in K'un L'n and defeating the dragon Shou-Lao etc. etc. etc.

Marvel could easily drop new actors into the roles and use them however they want in the future, and I don't see how the Netflix series would limit them in any meaningful way.

It's just like in the comics, different artists and writers have slightly different takes. The characters shift and evolve over time, but readers are, and should be forgiving enough that they won't say: "Hey! That can't happen because in issue 125 on page 12 in the 4th panel, the character said "XXXX".

If Marvel is going to be making films and TV shows for the next 30 years, they need to pin themselves, to some extent, to the comic books and films that have come before, but we need to give them reasonable wiggle room to continue to create and tell new stories.

Why would Marvel need to change the actors??

 

[Darkprime]

If they recast everyone that would signal the cold hard truth that Feige never saw the Netflix MCU as canon and wants to distant himself from those versions.

Notice Feige always gives a vague answer when asked if the netflix heroes will ever crossover? he always uses the timing excuse. Or avengers 3 and 4 had too many characters already. Believe me if Feige wanted them in Avengers 3/4 he would have made it happen but alas he didnt.

The netflix shows being in the MCU with their little easter eggs always felt like a marketing stunt to string people along who kept watching hoping for a crossover.

 

[Iceman]

Charlie Cox being recast is almost inconceivable to me. He’s to Daredevil like RDJ is to Iron Man imo.

I can’t imagine a new Kingpin or Punisher either.

 

[Darkprime]

heres a quote from the russos earlier in the year

"We thought of everything. But the trick is that we already have at least sixty characters with whom we must tell a story! And it's hard enough to communicate with Taika Waititi, Ryan Coogler, Scott Derrickson, Peyton Reed and James Gunn at the same time, not to add all the showrunners and TV crews to this. The latter is also led by totally different people. So it's practically impossible. Our job is to focus on the Marvel film world and offer a satisfying climax. "

The bolded is also inportant to note. Feige does not run the Netflix MCU loeb does. Which is probably the main reason a crossover hasnt happened. so yes they are in the MCU by proxy. But because both sides have different people in charge its jist not gonna happen. unless after the Fox merger somehow Marvel TV moves under Feige like its been rumored. Remember igers there shouldnt be two marvels quote?

And now Feige will have his hand in the streaming shows for Disney+ it would make sens to move Marvel tv under Feige. if that happens then we can start talking crossover potential but while loeb is still head of marvel tv i just dont see it happening.

 

[Dark Raven]

heres a quote from the russos earlier in the year

"We thought of everything. But the trick is that we already have at least sixty characters with whom we must tell a story! And it's hard enough to communicate with Taika Waititi, Ryan Coogler, Scott Derrickson, Peyton Reed and James Gunn at the same time, not to add all the showrunners and TV crews to this. The latter is also led by totally different people. So it's practically impossible. Our job is to focus on the Marvel film world and offer a satisfying climax. "

The bolded is also inportant to note. Feige does not run the Netflix MCU loeb does. Which is probably the main reason a crossover hasnt happened. so yes they are in the MCU by proxy. But because both sides have different people in charge its jist not gonna happen. unless after the Fox merger somehow Marvel TV moves under Feige like its been rumored. Remember igers there shouldnt be two marvels quote?

And now Feige will have his hand in the streaming shows for Disney+ it would make sens to move Marvel tv under Feige. if that happens then we can start talking crossover potential but while loeb is still head of marvel tv i just dont see it happening.

The excuse before was that they didn't know what someone would be doing in a TV series so it would be difficult to co-ordinate with them. But now that Iron Fist and Luke Cage are cancelled, there is no longer that problem. If DD were cancelled too, then he would also be free to be used whenever and could pop up at any time without any scheduling problems.

 

[Darkprime]

I still don't really buy that excuse. If it really was a schedule issue. And Feige really wanted the Defenders to show up in the movies they would have figured out a way to make it work. I mean look at all the actors schedules they had to juggle for Avengers 3 and 4. Right now I think the biggest barrier is probably office politics. Feige doesnt get along with perlmutter. I'm not sure how he feels about Loeb. But I've often wondered if Feige wanted to use Daredevil in the MCU but Ike went above him and green lit the Netflix series just to piss him off.

Remember the big break up in 2015?

Marvel Shake-Up: Film Chief Kevin Feige Breaks Free of CEO Ike Perlmutter (Exclusive)

 

[Dark Raven]

I still don't really buy that excuse. If it really was a schedule issue. And Feige really wanted the Defenders to show up in the movies they would have figured out a way to make it work. I mean look at all the actors schedules they had to juggle for Avengers 3 and 4. Right now I think the biggest barrier is probably office politics. Feige doesnt get along with perlmutter. I'm not sure how he feels about Loeb. But I've often wondered if Feige wanted to use Daredevil in the MCU but Ike went above him and green lit the Netflix series just to piss him off.

Remember the big break up in 2015?

Marvel Shake-Up: Film Chief Kevin Feige Breaks Free of CEO Ike Perlmutter (Exclusive)

Well of course it's an excuse, and they could've found a way around it if they really wanted to use these characters. But I'm saying that now they have no excuse to hide behind because some of these characters aren't doing anything.

 

[Xeno]

Why would Marvel need to change the actors??

Because they're rebooting those series. (If they decide to do so.) The guy who played Iron Fist is definitely in need of a reboot right out of the MCU.

 

[Abudefduf]

I'm starting to believe that the only reason IF got a gritty & grounded show instead of a movie was because Marvel didn't want to separate him from his buddy Luke Cage.

Here's what Feige said in an old interview from 2010:
Marvel Considering 'Iron Fist' & 'S.H.I.E.L.D.' Movies, 'Black Panther' & 'Guardians Of The Galaxy,' Too!

"I think what Ed Brubaker and Matt Fraction have done with 'Iron Fist' lately is exciting," Feige told MTV News. "I think 'Black Panther' and Wakanda has some amazing potential to be a feature film. 'Doctor Strange,' as you've mentioned. There are some obscure titles, too, like 'Guardians of the Galaxy.' I think they've been revamped recently in a fun way in the book."

Notice how all the characters he mentioned eventually got their own movies, except for Iron Fist. If that isn't proof that at one point Feige was seriously considering making an Iron Fist movie, then I don't know what it is.

I see no reason for Marvel to take on the Inhumans when they’re already working on the Eternals and in the near future possibly going to be working on the X-Men(which ironically enough at one point the Inhumans was originally supposed to serve as the MCU replacement of them).

I understand fans want the Inhumans to be done justice but we’re likely not going to be seeing the Inhumans on screen again for a very long time. Like I said with Daredevil, that’s a property I can’t see crossing over into the Marvel movies until the rest of the MCU is totally rebooted and after Feige is no longer calling the shots. The Inhumans is going to be dead for a while, I’m afraid.

No I agree with that. What I was trying to say is that some characters don't deserve to die along with the bad shows they were featured in.

 

[Darkprime]

I wonder if they used concepts and ideas from that shield movie that would eventually become agents of shield? or maybe they'll use bits of it for the supposed Nick Fury series on Disney+

 

[Detective Conan]

I'm starting to believe that the only reason IF got a gritty & grounded show instead of a movie was because Marvel didn't want to separate him from his buddy Luke Cage.

Here's what Feige said in an old interview from 2010:
Marvel Considering 'Iron Fist' & 'S.H.I.E.L.D.' Movies, 'Black Panther' & 'Guardians Of The Galaxy,' Too

I have to admit I actually think Iron Fist would’ve been a much better fit for the Marvel movies than on Netflix. It could’ve been Marvel’s first Martial-arts movie that would be essentially the superhero version of Enter The Dragon. What a missed opportunity.

 

[babykhris]

With the FOX/Disney merger almost done I expect a ton of layoffs. Right now it would be smart for Marvel Studios to absorb Marvel Television & Marvel Animation into the fold. Disney+ is going to need content and that should be TV's job.

Now before you complain about Loeb's job remember he did had to work under cheap Perlmutter. Under Disney the budgets will increase.

 

[Marvel united]

With the FOX/Disney merger almost done I expect a ton of layoffs. Right now it would be smart for Marvel Studios to absorb Marvel Television & Marvel Animation into the fold. Disney+ is going to need content and that should be TV's job.

Now before you complain about Loeb's job remember he did had to work under cheap Perlmutter. Under Disney the budgets will increase.

And hopefully Daredevil and the Heroes for Hire will return to Marvel Studios. I would love to see what Feige could do with Luke and Danny

 

[Darkprime]

So Fox's head of tv Dana Walden is moving to Disney so could that in theory make Ike redundant? Or would Ike just report to Dana? The best scenario would be Ike becomes redundant and then Dana takes control of Marvel TV under Disney TV and have Dana report to Feige for all marvel related content.

 

[2kt09]

So Fox's head of tv Dana Walden is moving to Disney so could that in theory make Ike redundant? Or would Ike just report to Dana? The best scenario would be Ike becomes redundant and then Dana takes control of Marvel TV under Disney TV and have Dana report to Feige for all marvel related content.

Whatever it takes to get Jeph Loeb off of it.

 

[Iceman]

I have to admit I actually think Iron Fist would’ve been a much better fit for the Marvel movies than on Netflix. It could’ve been Marvel’s first Martial-arts movie that would be essentially the superhero version of Enter The Dragon. What a missed opportunity.

It still can be. We haven't exactly seen much of Iron Fist in the show.

 

[babykhris]

Whatever it takes to get Jeph Loeb off of it.

Is Loeb really the problem?? I feel his hands been tied by Perlmutter but he’s given us some quality shows during his tenure

 

[2kt09]

Is Loeb really the problem?? I feel his hands been tied by Perlmutter but he’s given us some quality shows during his tenure

Absolutely. It traces back to the animated shows before so much more of the focus went to the live-action fare. Albeit, the mo is flipped. They threw anything and everything into those cartoons minus quality writing & animation, yet take an even more timid & cheaper approach with the live-action shows. They're also more serialized, yet drag out these plots and characters to absolute monotony. I figure that's why people are stoked to be getting some miniseries with the movie actors on the streaming service, as that worked out well enough for Peggy. Rare exceptions occur due to the showrunner(s) being that much better than their "grounded" bottomline.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Absolutely. It traces back to the animated shows before so much more of the focus went to the live-action fare. Albeit, the mo is flipped. They threw anything and everything into those cartoons minus quality writing & animation, yet take an even more timid & cheaper approach with the live-action shows. They're also more serialized, yet drag out these plots and characters to absolute monotony. I figure that's why people are stoked to be getting some miniseries with the movie actors on the streaming service, as that worked out well enough for Peggy. Rare exceptions occur due to the showrunner(s) being that much better than their "grounded" bottomline.

I'll take the majority of the Netflix slate over Agent Carter any day, and that's season one. Even Iron Fist Season 1 looked Emmy Award Winning compared to the awful Season 2 of Agent Carter.

Daredevil is not only better than any other CBM show, it is also arguably better than even the best MCU feature films.