The Amazing Spider-Man 2 The Scene Gwen Stacey Died - Part 2

[Picard Sisko]

I don't know who I like more, Gwen or MJ. I was introduced to MJ first because of the 90s animated series, USM, and SM1, but I also love Gwen.

 

[GENERAL RAAM582]

So it's pretty debatable if the web did it? I thought I remembered a "SNAP" text in the one panel when he says, "Did it."

 

[Spideyfan117]

Gwen all the way for me. I like her 616 incarnation. And the Spectacular tv and TASM versions really make me love her. She's sweet, but she's got a bit of spunk. And she's also smart.

MJ's still cool, though. As is Felicia Hardy.

 

[Picard Sisko]

So it's pretty debatable if the web did it? I thought I remembered a "SNAP" text in the one panel when he says, "Did it."

I don't think there was ever a clear confirmation as to whether or not Spider-Man was responsible for Gwen's neck snapping. He may have pulled on his webbing too fast.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Gwen all the way for me. I like her 616 incarnation. And the Spectacular tv and TASM versions really make me love her. She's sweet, but she's got a bit of spunk. And she's also smart.

MJ's still cool, though. As is Felicia Hardy.

Well Felicia Hardy is in a whole different league...

But yeah, I totally agree with you!

 

[Airnick]

I don't think there was ever a clear confirmation as to whether or not Spider-Man was responsible for Gwen's neck snapping. He may have pulled on his webbing too fast.

The letters page on ASM#125 states: "It saddens us to say that the whiplash effect she underwent when Spidey's webbing stopped her so suddenly was, in fact, what killed her."

 

[GENERAL RAAM582]

The letters page on ASM#125 states: "It saddens us to say that the whiplash effect she underwent when Spidey's webbing stopped her so suddenly was, in fact, what killed her."

Ah, OK. So yeah, the record still stands.

 

[Picard Sisko]

The letters page on ASM#125 states: "It saddens us to say that the whiplash effect she underwent when Spidey's webbing stopped her so suddenly was, in fact, what killed her."

Okay, thanks for confirming that!

 

[Airnick]

Ah, OK. So yeah, the record still stands.

Okay, thanks for confirming that!

No problem!.

 

[sl500jazz]

honestly I was never a Gwen Fan, so her death never impacted me I always loved Mary Jane Watson from the get-go her introduction panel hooked me from the start.

I don't dislike Gwen, but definitely prefer MJ. Was also hooked from the get-go and I'm looking forward to her introduction in this new film universe.

It's funny that Gerry Conway never really anticipated the long lasting effects that 'The Night Gwen Stacy died' would have. He chose to kill her because he thought that she was 'too nice and boring' and didn't know what else to do with her, and he believed that Mary Jane and Peter had personalities that could play off of each other better. Stan often says in interviews that whenever they had Gwen and MJ pitted against each other, despite their best efforts to make Gwen the star, MJ became a fan favorite. He disagreed with Conway about killing her though and there was quite an uproar from the readers of the comic when it happened.

I can appreciate what Webb & co. have added to Gwen's character, but with 616 Gwen, it probably never could have worked. She blamed Spidey for her father's death and probably wasn't strong enough to handle the superhero life considering that she broke into tears when Peter revealed his secret in ASM #87.

 

[Perry9]

Don't you just love those old comics that REVEL THE MOST IMPORTANT PLOT POINT OF THE ISSUE FROM THE FREAKING COVER????

 

[Picard Sisko]

This cover just said that someone is going to die. Didn't say who though. But here's the thing.. people "died" in comic books all the time, so that didn't mean much to readers. I honestly love that the name of the story didn't appear until the very last panel.

 

[Super Jim]

Have an alternate theory on the events you might be interested in;

Spider-man is popular after the events of the first movie and subsequently saving people - which we see a montage of including rescuing people from a burning building and saving Maxwell Dillon when stopping a crook Aleksei Sytsevich.

Maxwell Dillon becomes obsessed with Spider-man and ends up in an accident leading him to become Electro. Gwen is on the rise at Oscorp however they want her to transfer to work at an Oscorp Power Plant in London - this leads to Peter getting emotional when working as Spider-man.

However he is still wracked with guilt over Gwen's father and finds he is seeing her father everywhere - leading him to question if he and Gwen are right for each other.

Swinging through the city he discovers Aleksei Sytsevich again however Aleksei unveils some Oscorp technology leading Peter to battle 'The Rhino' who he defeats by shutting off his power.

That night Peter and Gwen are talking about her moving away - when Electro attacks times square leading to a battle with Spider-man which destroys times square. Electro realising what he has done retreats. Gwen leaves to go to London as Harry Osborn arrives back in New York.

Peter goes to see him - leading to them discussing Norman Osborn. While Peter goes to Aunt May for advice eventually leading him to discover his parents laboratory and realise Oscorp is behind everything, Norman talks to Harry revealing Peter is Spider-man and telling him to go to RavenCroft before seemingly passing away.

Harry is shown Electro at RavenCroft (Who was captured off-screen) and they set to work to improve him - with Harry convincing him that he is more powerful than everyone.

Spider-man confronts Harry about Oscorp and what their plan is - this is likely after he discovers about the death of his parents via a plane crash orchestrated by Oscorp.

This leads Harry to become the Green Goblin - wounding his secretary and potential love-interest of the movie (Felicity Jones) before kidnapping Gwen from the Oscorp building.

Spider-man discovers (Felicity Jones) and finds out that the Green Goblin is going after Gwen.

We cut to London - where Gwen has just arrived, its daytime and she's looking out over a bridge. Peter arrives in London that evening and heads to the Oscorp Power Plant. Peter (As Spider-man) is about to talk to Gwen when the Green Goblin arrives.

The Green Goblin orders Electro to attack him. Electro fights Spider-man before being seemingly destroyed when the power plant is shutdown (Similar to how Rhino was defeated earlier) removing the Electricity he needs to maintain a physical form.

Green Goblin picks up Gwen carrying her up and dropping her - Spider-man catches her as they fall into a clock tower. This leads to a tense moments as he saves Gwen. However, Green Goblin attacks leading to a short battle that ends with him pinning Spider-man down attempting to stab him with a knife weapon.

They battle resulting in the death of Harry when he is accidentally stabbed by Peter (This is the scene of Peter crying in the trailer) Gwen unfortunately reveals that she cant move back to New York and breaks up with Peter.

A funeral is held for Harry and Peter ends up visiting his grave and the grave of his parents as the movie ends he promises that his life as Spider-man has to come first - with great power comes the need for great responsibility.

After the credits we witness the mysterious man as he goes down an elevator into the lower sections of Oscorp walking past the suits of Doctor Octopus and Vulture. He continues walking as we see Lizard, Rhino and Electro inside of cell cages - each seemingly under Oscorp control via electronic chips. We witness him as he goes to a life-support machine and talks to the occupant

"How are you feeling, Norman?"

The occupants eyes open as he begins turning Green, his skin bulging with muscle - signalling the arrival of Norman Osborn as the true Green Goblin.


-----

This sets up 'The Sinister Six' for the third film lead by Green Goblin and consisting of Doc Ock, Vulture, Electro, Rhino and Lizard.

It also sets up Norman Osborn as the main villain in the third movie to bring the Oscorp storyline to an end.

In addition it would establish that the mysterious man 'The Gentleman' is working with Norman Osborn.

It also keeps Gwen Stacey alive - however the death of Harry - Peter blames on himself thus giving us a similar situation to Gwen's death without killing her.

It also allows the third film to focus on Peter Parker/Spider-man more than the other characters as without Gwen he doesn't need a love interest for the third movie - although they could introduce Mary Jane.

It also leaves the possibility open for Gwen to return at some point.

Well, some of what you've come up with is accurate and is what we've been discussing on this threade for a while, while some of what you've come up with is way off. Let me analyze what you wrote:

"Spider-man is popular after the events of the first movie and subsequently saving people - which we see a montage of including rescuing people from a burning building and saving Maxwell Dillon when stopping a crook Aleksei Sytsevich."

Sure, we've all see this in the trailers.

"Maxwell Dillon becomes obsessed with Spider-man and ends up in an accident leading him to become Electro. Gwen is on the rise at Oscorp however they want her to transfer to work at an Oscorp Power Plant in London - this leads to Peter getting emotional when working as Spider-man."

Yes, we all know that Max will become obsessed with Spidey and will get into an accident with the eels. But this idea of Gwen being "on the rise at Oscorp" and they wanting to "tranfer (her) to work at an Oscorp Power Plant in London" is way off. Haven't seen anything to suggest she's "on the rise". Hey, she's smart and probably an asset to Oscorp, but she's not one of the head honchos, if you get my point. Also, the only indication of London is Gwen going to Oxford. The Power Plant is something that Max is working on (hence the blueprints he has when Peter saves him) and is most definitely in New York, not London.

"However he is still wracked with guilt over Gwen's father and finds he is seeing her father everywhere - leading him to question if he and Gwen are right for each other."

Yes, we know that Peter will be seeing Captain Stacy, but this won't lead him to wonder is he and Gwen are "right for each other", but instead will make Peter guilty because of the promise he made. This may lead to them breaking up in the Chinatown scene.

"Swinging through the city he discovers Aleksei Sytsevich again however Aleksei unveils some Oscorp technology leading Peter to battle 'The Rhino' who he defeats by shutting off his power."

Most of us believe there will be 2 Aleskei battles. The first will be the armored car chase at the beginning of the movie. I have speculated that Aleskei is trying to steal a power source for his Russian mech. As far as how Spidey will defeat the Rhino Mech in the second Aleskei scene, there is no indication that he will shut off the power. All we see is him using a manhole cover to smack the Mech upside the head.

"That night Peter and Gwen are talking about her moving away - when Electro attacks times square leading to a battle with Spider-man which destroys times square. Electro realising what he has done retreats. Gwen leaves to go to London as Harry Osborn arrives back in New York."

Yes, we've already discussed this scene in this thread. Personally I believe that Spiderman will somehow defeat Electro in this scene in order for Max to end up in Ravencroft. Also, most of us are pretty sure that the second Aleskei scene, where he is in the mech, and the Max accident and Times Square, is AFTER the gap between Peter and Gwen breaking up and all of these things (Mech Rhino/Max's birthday/the Market Date scene/Max's accident/Etc.). In other words, Gwen leaving after Times Square doesn't make any sense and I believe is not correct.

"Peter goes to see him - leading to them discussing Norman Osborn. While Peter goes to Aunt May for advice eventually leading him to discover his parents laboratory and realise Oscorp is behind everything, Norman talks to Harry revealing Peter is Spider-man and telling him to go to RavenCroft before seemingly passing away."

Yes, we've already talked about how Harry showing Peter that he was being tracked, etc., will likely lead to Peter confronting Aunt May, which will lead to him finding the underground railroad lab. I have also speculated in this thread that Norman will die, which might be a catalyst for Harry to go off the deep end.

"Harry is shown Electro at RavenCroft (Who was captured off-screen) and they set to work to improve him - with Harry convincing him that he is more powerful than everyone."

Yes, we've seen the scene where Harry and likely Dr. Kafka are "amping" up Electro. Likely Harry has been directed to do this by his father. Seems obvious that Harry loses control of Max.

"Spider-man confronts Harry about Oscorp and what their plan is - this is likely after he discovers about the death of his parents via a plane crash orchestrated by Oscorp."

Yes, this is likely that one scene where we see Spiderman and Harry in some very nice apartment, or something like that. I believe this will likely be more about Electro than anything else.

"This leads Harry to become the Green Goblin - wounding his secretary and potential love-interest of the movie (Felicity Jones) before kidnapping Gwen from the Oscorp building."

Yes, around this point in the movie Harry will become the Goblin. And yes, Felicity will be seen during this scene (not sure about her being wounded though). But Gwen will not be "kidnapped" from Oscorp. In fact, we know that Gwen will help Peter prepare to fight Electro, Peter will web her to the car hood, and then, after Max is defeated, Gobbie will get Gwen, which will lead to the whole clock tower thing, which again, all happens in New York.

"Spider-man discovers (Felicity Jones) and finds out that the Green Goblin is going after Gwen."

Not sure about this one. There is no evidence to support it. Most likely Peter will head to the bridge, near the power plant (again, in New York) where Gwen and he will have their talk prior to him fighting Electro. Again, not sure how involved Felicity will be in this.

"We cut to London - where Gwen has just arrived, its daytime and she's looking out over a bridge. Peter arrives in London that evening and heads to the Oscorp Power Plant. Peter (As Spider-man) is about to talk to Gwen when the Green Goblin arrives."

Um, nope. We actually have seen Spidey and Gwen come down from the bridge, which leads directly to the power plant fight (IN NEW YORK). Again, the only London connection is Gwen at Oxford, which likely never happens. Gwen tells Peter about Oxford during their market date, right before Times Square. And again this is after the approx. one year gap between them breaking up and this point. I just don't see Gwen jumping on a plane to London after being webbed to that car hood, while Peter is battling Electro, and then Harry flying all the way there, and then Peter flying there, to end the movie in London. That all makes no sense.

"The Green Goblin orders Electro to attack him. Electro fights Spider-man before being seemingly destroyed when the power plant is shutdown (Similar to how Rhino was defeated earlier) removing the Electricity he needs to maintain a physical form."

From what we've seen no one is telling Electro to do anything. Electro is not some henchman to Gobbie. Also there has to be something way more involved in defeating Electro than just removing the power.

"Green Goblin picks up Gwen carrying her up and dropping her - Spider-man catches her as they fall into a clock tower. This leads to a tense moments as he saves Gwen. However, Green Goblin attacks leading to a short battle that ends with him pinning Spider-man down attempting to stab him with a knife weapon."

Yes, we've painstakingly analyzed this entire scene, which is really what this whole thread has been about.

"They battle resulting in the death of Harry when he is accidentally stabbed by Peter (This is the scene of Peter crying in the trailer) Gwen unfortunately reveals that she cant move back to New York and breaks up with Peter."

Not likely. You'll need to read the prior 20 pages of this thread to see how we've almost 100% proven that it will be Gwen that dies, and not Harry. Likely Harry, a character just introduced, will get away, but we'll see on that point. But for the emotion that Peter shows at the bottom of the clock tower, after we see Gwen falling towards the bottom of the clock tower, because Peter lost the web that she was hanging from keeping her from falling to the bottom of the clock tower, well, it's a good bet that it's for Gwen, who has fallen to the bottom of the clock tower. Just saying... Most of us can't see Peter showing that level of emotion for Harry and that only those most close to him (Gwen or May) would elicit that level of angst.

"A funeral is held for Harry and Peter ends up visiting his grave and the grave of his parents as the movie ends he promises that his life as Spider-man has to come first - with great power comes the need for great responsibility."

Yes, we've all seen Peter at a cemetary. Whether he is visiting the grave of Gwen after she has died, or more likely Uncle Ben or Captain Stacy, has been up for debate. It is likely NOT Harry. This is likely the end of the movie and after Gwen dies I could see Peter talking to Gwen and Captain Stacy, which will give us some really good emotion. People are gonna cry!!!!!

"After the credits we witness the mysterious man as he goes down an elevator into the lower sections of Oscorp walking past the suits of Doctor Octopus and Vulture. He continues walking as we see Lizard, Rhino and Electro inside of cell cages - each seemingly under Oscorp control via electronic chips. We witness him as he goes to a life-support machine and talks to the occupant

"How are you feeling, Norman?"

The occupants eyes open as he begins turning Green, his skin bulging with muscle - signalling the arrival of Norman Osborn as the true Green Goblin."

Yes, that scene might be mid-credits, or it might be around when Harry is turned into the Goblin. It is very unlikely that we'll see the Lizard in this scene, or Rhino or Electro. In fact, Jamie said something like "electricity never goes away", which makes us think that Electro will be disipated (maybe there's a better word) during the final battle, but he could come back in a future movie. He won't be in the post credits scene, likely.

It is questionable whether they would just turn Norman into a second version of the Goblin after we just had Harry. We know that Norman will have a more involved role in TASM3, but we don't know yet what it will be.

Actually, I believe that if this scene of The Man in the Shadows is post credits then he'll walk past numerous chambers, and I've speculated elsewhere what could be in these other chambers) before going to a room with drawers. He'll open one showing Norman's body (Norman, having died earlier) and then inject something. The scene would end with either Norman's eyes opening or his finger twiching...

-----

"This sets up 'The Sinister Six' for the third film lead by Green Goblin and consisting of Doc Ock, Vulture, Electro, Rhino and Lizard."

Yes, I started arguing that the S6 will be next a long, long time ago. Not sure if Electro will make it in though...

It also sets up Norman Osborn as the main villain in the third movie to bring the Oscorp storyline to an end.

Of course he's the "main" villain in TASM3. Ultimately all of this is about Oscorp, which means Norman.

In addition it would establish that the mysterious man 'The Gentleman' is working with Norman Osborn.

Yes, the Gentleman is one of the options that makes sense since he brought the Sinister Six together in one of the comic stories.

It also keeps Gwen Stacey alive - however the death of Harry - Peter blames on himself thus giving us a similar situation to Gwen's death without killing her.

Sorry, Gwen's purpose is to die so Peter can grow. Harry's death won't do this, especially in this story where they are barely friends.

It also allows the third film to focus on Peter Parker/Spider-man more than the other characters as without Gwen he doesn't need a love interest for the third movie - although they could introduce Mary Jane.

Why keep Gwen from dying if you're not going to use her as the love interest? That makes no sense at all! Either she dies, so Peter can grow, or Webb switches it up and keeps her alive, and Peter's and her love grows. Look, Gwen will die, Peter will grow, hopefully Back Cat will be in TASM3 as a flirty kind of love interest (but not really from Peter's point of view) and MJ will be introduced as nothing more than a friend.

It also leaves the possibility open for Gwen to return at some point

Oh, she'll be back, but just in Peter's nightmares and possibly flashbacks. Actually, one idea that someone came up with, which would be amazing, is for Mysterio to be one of the Six and to use images of Gwen to mess with Peter! I guess this could also be done by the Camelion! But either way, I am sure we'll see Emma reprise her role, at least a bit, in TASM3!

 

[webhead9707]

616: I prefer MJ. Gwen was a bit stuck up and preppy.
Ultimate: I honestly can't decide. MJ is awesome, I adore her, but Gwen is bad A and has that punk rocker appeal.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

This cover just said that someone is going to die. Didn't say who though. But here's the thing.. people "died" in comic books all the time, so that didn't mean much to readers. I honestly love that the name of the story didn't appear until the very last panel.

People did die in comics, but not the main love interest by the hands of the villain. Prior to Gwen's death, whenever the damsel in distress was kidnapped, the hero would somehow swoop/swing/jump in at the last minute and make the save. Her death changed things. It's one of the stories credited with ending the Silver Age. Innocence lost.

 

[Picard Sisko]

People did die in comics, but not the main love interest by the hands of the villain. Prior to Gwen's death, whenever the damsel in distress was kidnapped, the hero would somehow swoop/swing/jump in at the last minute and make the save. Her death changed things. It's one of the stories credited with ending the Silver Age. Innocence lost.

Yeah, that's basically what I meant.

 

[bapi]

Gwen and Peter clip

 

[Morbius]

Gwen and Peter clip

Full of fuzzy warm feelings

 

[Picard Sisko]

I love how Aunt May responds to Gwen. Yeah, I think she knows something...

 

[Morbius]

I love how Aunt May responds to Gwen. Yeah, I think she knows something...

Okay, i'm at work and can't spend too much time on this - did I miss something? What happens?

 

[AnneFan]

I love how Aunt May responds to Gwen. Yeah, I think she knows something...

Indeed. I got this impression in TASM. Sally Field is lovely.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Okay, i'm at work and can't spend too much time on this - did I miss something? What happens?

Spoiler

Gwen Stacy knocks on Peter's door, but Aunt May answers. She responds with, "Peter is doing... what he does."

Indeed. I got this impression in TASM. Sally Field is lovely.

Agreed. So glad she is playing Aunt May (though I will always love Rosemary Harris).

 

[AnneFan]

Agreed. So glad she is playing Aunt May (though I will always love Rosemary Harris).

Both are so good in the role. I think I prefer Sally.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Both are so good in the role. I think I prefer Sally.

Rosemary Harris did a good job at portraying the classic Aunt May (though she was a lot brighter than her comic book counterpart), and Sally Field seems to resemble the character from the Ultimate comics.

 

[Morbius]

Rosemary Harris did a good job at portraying the classic Aunt May (though she was a lot brighter than her comic book counterpart), and Sally Field seems to resemble the character from the Ultimate comics.

Definitely! I can tell that her character as well as Sheen's Uncle Ben had some hippy roots!