The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 24

[Kahran Ramsus]

I really hope that Apple/Sony buyout doesn't happen. Apple owning the PlayStation brand would be a nightmare. They'd probably try to turn it into a streaming cloud service or something. I care far more about that than Spider-Man.

 

[Darkprime]

I really hope that Apple/Sony buyout doesn't happen. Apple owning the PlayStation brand would be a nightmare. They'd probably try to turn it into a streaming cloud service or something. I care far more about that than Spider-Man.

Apple wont own Sony entirely it would only be Sony pictures they would be buying if it happens.

 

[Tymminator]

Oh hell, Dan Slott says that he wants to start writing Spider-Man comics again. He'll take that on after he's done destroying Marvel history, I suppose.

I used to like Slott. After OMD when he started BND, I didn't care for his stories but still didn't mind him as a comic writer or as a person. Soon after though, he would jump on message boards and argue with fans and use inane logic to justify the stuff he was doing in Spidey at that time. After that, I actually avoided reading stuff he writes, even if it was a title I would normally read. I heard the Otto as Spider-man was a decent run, but I will never know because I don't care to read anything he writes. There are plenty or writers who I do not agree with on various things but will still read their stuff as I don't expect everyone to always agree with me or whomever, but Slott really rubbed me the very wrong way.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Apple wont own Sony entirely it would only be Sony pictures they would be buying if it happens.

That I would be fine with. Sony is the worst of the major studios.

 

[Darkprime]

So based off some of the recent leaks and films that we know are going into production. i've figure that phase 4 will be some variation of the following films. This assumes Phase 4 is 10 films again.

Spider-Man: Far From Home (July 2019)
Black Widow (May 2020)
Eternals(November 2020)
Black Panther 2 (February 2021)
Doctor Strange 2(May 2021)
Shang-Chi (November 2021)
Captain Marvel 2 (February 2022)
Guardians of The Galaxy 3 (May, 2022)
Ant-Man 3 / Spider-Man 3 (July 2022)
Nova (February 2023)
New Avengers (April 2023)

you probably noticed the fox franchises are missing. Unpopular opinion here but I really don't think well see them in Phase 4 at least not standalone movies. we might see some characters pop up in Guardians 3, Captain Marvel 2 or Nova. Silver Surfer anyone? or Reed Richards in Ant-Man 3. Or a tease in Avengers 5. But I think well be waiting till phase 5 for Fantastic Four and X-Men standalones.

 

[MbJ]

I figured they could potentially start introducing some of them in supporting or small roles in other films, like Storm showing up in Black Panther 2 or the Shi'ar and Deathbird maybe being in Captain Marvel 2.

Hell, Silver Samurai could be a villain in the Shang-Chi movie.

 

[Docker2.0]

So based off some of the recent leaks and films that we know are going into production. i've figure that phase 4 will be some variation of the following films. This assumes Phase 4 is 10 films again.

Spider-Man: Far From Home (July 2019)
Black Widow (May 2020)
Eternals(November 2020)
Black Panther 2 (February 2021)
Doctor Strange 2(May 2021)
Shang-Chi (November 2021)
Captain Marvel 2 (February 2022)
Guardians of The Galaxy 3 (May, 2022)
Ant-Man 3 / Spider-Man 3 (July 2022)
Nova (February 2023)
New Avengers (April 2023)

you probably noticed the fox franchises are missing. Unpopular opinion here but I really don't think well see them in Phase 4 at least not standalone movies. we might see some characters pop up in Guardians 3, Captain Marvel 2 or Nova. Silver Surfer anyone? or Reed Richards in Ant-Man 3. Or a tease in Avengers 5. But I think well be waiting till phase 5 for Fantastic Four and X-Men standalones.

No way we don't see any of them. I think we will see Silver Surfer and Wolverine definitely. And I'd be super shocked if F4 doesn't find a way to make it into phase 4. It's basically made for them.

 

[Flint Marko]

Please buy Sony Apple. Please.

 

[Xeno]

I used to like Slott. After OMD when he started BND, I didn't care for his stories but still didn't mind him as a comic writer or as a person. Soon after though, he would jump on message boards and argue with fans and use inane logic to justify the stuff he was doing in Spidey at that time. After that, I actually avoided reading stuff he writes, even if it was a title I would normally read. I heard the Otto as Spider-man was a decent run, but I will never know because I don't care to read anything he writes. There are plenty or writers who I do not agree with on various things but will still read their stuff as I don't expect everyone to always agree with me or whomever, but Slott really rubbed me the very wrong way.

Slott is the worst of a bad lot when it comes to Marvel's current crop of writers. He and Nick Spencer have written some of the worst tripe Marvel has ever published. They inexplicably have fans, who usually end up saying, "But, but, you have to read all the way through to understand how great the writing is!" That's like saying that you have to eat spoiled food in order to know it's rotten when the first bite is enough.

After reading the first issues of the Octo-Spider and Hydra-Cap stories, I had had enough. Watching both writers arguing with fans on Twitter was annoying. Spencer, in particular, kept lying about HYDRA's Nazi origins. "HYDRA are not Nazis and never had anything to do with them!" seems to be the party line at Marvel, as if that would somehow excuse them turning Steve Rogers into a raving fascist if it were true.

The only relatively recent Marvel comics I've enjoyed were the DnA Guardians books. I also loved the Pet Avengers and Marvel Adventures books because they're great to share with kids. Maybe there are other good books out there but I'm not wading through the sewage Brevoort's minions spew out each month.

 

[Dark Raven]

Slott is the worst of a bad lot when it comes to Marvel's current crop of writers. He and Nick Spencer have written some of the worst tripe Marvel has ever published. They inexplicably have fans, who usually end up saying, "But, but, you have to read all the way through to understand how great the writing is!" That's like saying that you have to eat spoiled food in order to know it's rotten when the first bite is enough.

.

Isn't that what FFINO defenders wanted everyone to do with Fant4stic? That all of us should go see it for ourselves (and thereby boost the box office returns) to be able to decide for ourselves whether it was actually that bad?

 

[TheVileOne]

Marvel's constant status quo shattering event crossovers and DC rebooting everything pretty much killed superhero comics for me.

 

[MbJ]

No way we don't see any of them. I think we will see Silver Surfer and Wolverine definitely. And I'd be super shocked if F4 doesn't find a way to make it into phase 4. It's basically made for them.

Depends. There are some characters who could be slipped into supporting roles, but as it stands they have a whole bunch of properties already lined up. I could definitely see a scenario where they used Fantastic Four or the X-Men as a big Phase 5 opener, but right now they've got a lot on their plates. There's also the possibility with the X-Men that they'd be fine putting the property on ice for a bit so that the train wreck of Dark Phoenix won't be as fresh in everyone's minds.

 

[Bach]

Please buy Sony Apple. Please.

Let's not jump to conclusions, those are rumors based on contracts made years ago. For all we know, Spider-Man rights may not even revert if Apple buys Sony Pictures and things could be the same as now.

 

[Tymminator]

Marvel's constant status quo shattering event crossovers and DC rebooting everything pretty much killed superhero comics for me.

Re:Marvel: well also, when it comes to team books, they are all almost interchangeable...their core concepts are all but ignored and what made one super-group unique to the next is pretty much gone. Spider-man they messed up so much on that you could write a book just on that, Loeb took the Ultimates that were awesome under Millar and turned it into trash to the point that nuking the universe was a mercy killing. At least Miles was more or less saved.

Re: DC was cool pre: New 52, and the good stuff that came from New 52 could had been done without a New 52 existing. Aquaman and Batman I thought we’re great, but their books were not dependent on New 52 and would have worked fine as they were written if simply placed in pre-New 52 continuity.

Under New 52 they nuked the JSA which was a great title. They jacked up Teen Titans history and damaged Starfire (twit writer actually defended making her act ****ty) and all kinds of other mess. Rebirth was a step in the right direction, but they should was a quick fix to a problem they themselves created when they basically messed up a perfectly good thing, the foundation was good Pre New 52 and they didn’t need New 52 to happen.


I’m gonna stop, but I can rant on both companies for quite a while.

 

[TheVileOne]

Re:Marvel: well also, when it comes to team books, they are all almost interchangeable...their core concepts are all but ignored and what made one super-group unique to the next is pretty much gone. Spider-man they messed up so much on that you could write a book just on that, Loeb took the Ultimates that were awesome under Millar and turned it into trash to the point that nuking the universe was a mercy killing. At least Miles was more or less saved.

Re: DC was cool pre: New 52, and the good stuff that came from New 52 could had been done withought a New 52 existing (Aquaman and Batman I thought we’re great, but their books were not dependent on New 52)

They nuked the JSA which was a great title. They jacked up Teen Titans history and damaged Starfire (twit writer actually defended making her act ****ty) and all kinds of other mess. Rebirth was a step in the right direction, but they basically messed up a perfectly good thing, the foundation was good.


I’m gonna stop, but I can rant on both companies for quite a while.

The only book I could really tolerate post-New 52 was Justice League International. It was cancelled within a year. It was genuinely good.

It's like the writers are ashamed of working on superhero books and writing superhero stories.

 

[Xeno]

The only book I could really tolerate post-New 52 was Justice League International. It was cancelled within a year. It was genuinely good.

It's like the writers are ashamed of working on superhero books and writing superhero stories.

The real problem seems to be that the writers and artists aren't really interested in working on characters they don't own. They show no respect for the history or characterization of heroes who have been popular for decades. Guys like Slott and Spencer could make more money working at Image or one of the other companies that would allow them to own the characters they create. They may feel that they're "stuck" at Marvel, so they're destroying Marvel's iconic heroes instead of creating their own. Their editors and executives are complicit in the devastation. That may sound over-the-top, but Slott's latest "epic" tagline admitted as much: "Marvel History is Destroyed, March 2019."

 

[TheVileOne]

The real problem seems to be that the writers and artists aren't really interested in working on characters they don't own. They show no respect for the history or characterization of heroes who have been popular for decades. Guys like Slott and Spencer could make more money working at Image or one of the other companies that would allow them to own the characters they create. They may feel that they're "stuck" at Marvel, so they're destroying Marvel's iconic heroes instead of creating their own. Their editors and executives are complicit in the devastation. That may sound over-the-top, but Slott's latest "epic" tagline admitted as much: "Marvel History is Destroyed, March 2019."

I'd get angry but I'm sort of past that at this point. Now on one hand, I think things could be better for creators in comics. Bill Finger, Jack Kirby, and the Superman creators it seems never got a fair shake or weren't treated all that well while they were alive and not given the credit or financial renumeration they deserved.

On the other hand, I just do get this sense of resentment for these characters and their histories.

 

[Xeno]

I'd get angry but I'm sort of past that at this point. Now on one hand, I think things could be better for creators in comics. Bill Finger, Jack Kirby, and the Superman creators it seems never got a fair shake or weren't treated all that well while they were alive and not given the credit or financial renumeration they deserved.

On the other hand, I just do get this sense of resentment for these characters and their histories.

Creators absolutely deserve better compensation from Marvel and DC. It's disgusting that many of the people who created heroes that anchor billion-dollar franchises were never paid what their work merits. Marvel Comics should not only pay past creators enough to support them in retirement, but it should also ensure that current writers and artists are paid enough to make their work lucrative. Better pay would attract and retain top talent.

Beyond this, Marvel needs better editors than those who have allowed and encouraged the piss-poor storytelling that plagues its comic books today. The fish rots from the head, as the saying goes.

 

[Spidey_62]

The real problem seems to be that the writers and artists aren't really interested in working on characters they don't own. They show no respect for the history or characterization of heroes who have been popular for decades. Guys like Slott and Spencer could make more money working at Image or one of the other companies that would allow them to own the characters they create. They may feel that they're "stuck" at Marvel, so they're destroying Marvel's iconic heroes instead of creating their own. Their editors and executives are complicit in the devastation. That may sound over-the-top, but Slott's latest "epic" tagline admitted as much: "Marvel History is Destroyed, March 2019."

Ok, this is more than a bit hyperbolic and misinformed. Those "Marvel History is Destroyed" teasers are for a mini series in the vein of the Deadpool Kills the Marvel U miniseries. An alternate universe "Cosmic Ghost Rider Destroys the Marvel Universe", with Dan Slott nowhere in sight. Of course the teasers riled people up, and they were pretty dumb teasers. (honestly, too, Nick Spencer on Amazing Spider-Man is killing it as the book has been thoroughly solid and feels refreshed under his pen right now and it feels like he understands what makes the character's adventures great)

 

[Lip]

That seems kinda contradictory. So Endgame will be too crowded to have a post-credit scene teasing the Eternals, but a post-credit scene teasing the X-Men or FF is fine?

No. I said they won't have time to introduce or tease any of them during th movie. Just like what happened to Beta Ray Bill. The "rumour" people are talking about isn't about Eternals easter eggs. It's about introducing 2 characters there. I don't think they'll have time for that. As for post credit scene is a different scenario. They could have the Eternals there, but we all know there's always hype for post-credit scenes, I having the Eternals there would be, IMO, disappointing since not even the fans knows those characters.

I feel like for the A4 post credit scene they'd go for something bigger.

You obviously are hoping for a tease for the Fox characters, which is fine, but right now it doesn't make any more sense just by virtue of you liking those characters more.

Well, yes... If there's time I'm obviously hoping for FF or X-Men. And I'm sure I'm not the only one. I think 99.9% of this forum would prefer a FF or X-Men tease than the Eternals.

The "problem" with the Eternals post credit scene, as I said before, it's that I don't think there's hype enough...

 

[Abudefduf]

Well, but isn't that pretty much the point of post-credits scenes? To create anticipation for what's to come?

Again, maybe it's just me, but I don't see how hearing someone randomly name-drop mutants or the FF would be better than an actual sneak peek at what the new batch of MCU heroes looks like.

Yeah. If they're casting this early, a cameo makes sense.

I just noticed that you had already said the same thing. My bad.

 

[Lip]

Again, maybe it's just me, but I don't see how hearing someone randomly name-drop mutants or the FF would be better than an actual sneak peek at what the new batch of MCU heroes looks like.

I'd like to see a poll for that

"Would you prefer A4 teasing FF and X-Men (name dropping "Latveria", "Baxter building", "mutants", etc), or a tease for The Eternals?" Or a post-credit scene teasing Silver Surfer or The Eternals?

Don't get me wrong, I'm super hyped for the Eternals. After Guardians of the Galaxy I do want Marvel investing in those "obscure properties". I'm very curious to see what they're going to do with Eternals. But, realistically speaking, there will be more hype about FF and the X-Men than the Eternals.

 

[KBX]

2 extra credit scenes. One is for Spiderman FFH and the other one to tease the next big Marvel villain

 

[2kt09]

I'd like to see a poll for that

"Would you prefer A4 teasing FF and X-Men (name dropping "Latveria", "Baxter building", "mutants", etc), or a tease for The Eternals?" Or a post-credit scene teasing Silver Surfer or The Eternals?

Don't get me wrong, I'm super hyped for the Eternals. After Guardians of the Galaxy I do want Marvel investing in those "obscure properties". I'm very curious to see what they're going to do with Eternals. But, realistically speaking, there will be more hype about FF and the X-Men than the Eternals.

Eternals feels like another Inhumans placeholder. GOTG is at least well...the Space Avengers (whether OG team or '08 revamp).

 

[Dark Raven]

I'd like to see a poll for that

"Would you prefer A4 teasing FF and X-Men (name dropping "Latveria", "Baxter building", "mutants", etc), or a tease for The Eternals?" Or a post-credit scene teasing Silver Surfer or The Eternals?

Don't get me wrong, I'm super hyped for the Eternals. After Guardians of the Galaxy I do want Marvel investing in those "obscure properties". I'm very curious to see what they're going to do with Eternals. But, realistically speaking, there will be more hype about FF and the X-Men than the Eternals.

I'd rather have a name drop of FF or X-Men or a tease of Silver Surfer rather than Eternals. With Eternals, it's like ... "yeah, so what"? And I think a lot of the general audience would feel that way too. But knowing the FF or X-Men are going to join would be much bigger and more exciting.