The Dark Knight Rises You Have My Permission To Lounge - Part 4

[Tacit Ronin]

Don't worry. They weren't characters. They were all exposition.

 

[shauner111]

I never caught the name of any character in Inception.

Really? I know em all. But, it is my favorite Nolan film.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

JGL is the biggest exposition mouthpiece.
That ending made sure I avoided watching the movie again.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

No. Ellen Page is. She is there solely for exposition and to emotionally babysit Leo.

I like the flick. But boy oh boy. The exposition is unbearable.

 

[shauner111]

That ending is still one of my favorite endings in the history of cinema. And exposition can be necessary. For me it's done well in Inception. It is done in an entertaining way between characters (Leo and Ellen. JGL and Hardy). It's useful with this movie otherwise it would be very difficult to understand.

Interstellar is the movie that has some unnecessary exposition, most of which is not visually interesting or entertaining.

 

[BatmanBeyond]

Anyone thought the aftermath of that scene with Bruce and Rachel on top of each other and breathing hard was highly sexual? I know Nolan is a massive prude, but you just can't miss that on the editing room.

It got a laughter every screening I saw it in.

Dunno how I really never thought of that scene in those terms, but it's staying with me forever now.

I think Nolan being a prude is as much of a myth as his movies being emotionally cold.

And speaking of Inception, I've never really been bothered by the exposition in it, haha. I think it serves the plot and the movie itself well and when exposition does that, I give it a pass.

Still, The Prestige takes the cake in terms of favourite Nolan flick. I think that movie is pretty close to perfect. Gotta watch it again to make sure. t:

You know, the whole Talia head shake death scene is noted for how awful it is. But Nolan definitely shot a similar death before.

Ken Watanabe's "death" in the snow section of Inception also has a similar head shake. It's quickly cut away so you don't notice it.

Nolan seems to have trouble with directing people dying slowly.

Funny thing - last time I watched TDKR, I can't say I was that bothered by Talia's death scene. I mean, yes, it's cheesy, but there's nothing really wrong with it. What is silly is Batman, Catwoman and Gordon just glaring at her while she dies, while the freakin' bomb is a minute or so away from exploding.

I have a pretty complicated relationship with Rises myself, the writing in several places just not being up to scratch to the previous two entries in the trilogy being my main beef. It just doesn't deliver some things that I think it should deliver as emphatically as BB and TDK did. Having said that, I love the conclusion to Bruce's arc and the way Nolan handled it, it made his take on the character probably my favourite so far. Bale had a hand in that as well, of course.

My overall feelings on it are not dissimilar to Joker's - it's a good movie, but it has a few rather glaring flaws. That said, it rounds out the trilogy quite beautifully.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I'm pretty certain Nolan confirmed that it was from the fall with Two Face.

Interesting. I always thought it was cumulative from his time as Batman combined with him being older. Like how a lot of football players have major knee problems by the time they are 40-50.

There would be no way to fix that either. The brace in TDKR would just be a temporary measure so he could function, but the knee would never be what it was when he was younger.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

He never mentioned putting two and two together about Batman and his toys. For all anyone knows Batman steals his gadgetry, or had some eccentric money bags financing his venture. He said he knew who Bruce was based solely on a look. It was common knowledge that Bruce Wayne lost his parents when he was a kid. Of course he was hiding the pain of that. That doesn't make him Batman.

It was a stupid writing.

Yeah, it sucked. I still prefer TDKR to BB, but that explanation was terrible.

 

[shauner111]

It's terrible that nobody else in the trilogy didn't figure it out. I find the Blake scene more realistic, while everything else in the comics and movies, as far as not figuring out Batman's identity, to be unrealistic. I'm not surprised that hardcore comic book fans would find that scene ridiculous. The only complaints I see about that scene comes from big batman comic book geeks. No offense but it's true. I've always been a fan of the comics but not hardcore. Like myself, the big film fans who don't read comics too often tend to understand that scene and it's logic. Not trying to pick a fight but this seems to be the case at least from my perspective. I really only see hardcore batman comic guys (and gals) pick on this scene endlessly. Which makes me laugh since it's one of the more realistic scenes of the entire trilogy. And yes, there's nothing wrong with putting two and two together. That's what cinema is for. Not every single thing Nolan does involves holding your hand...even though he does that a lot.

Just because it's done that way in the comics doesn't make the comics the RIGHT way. Some of the most ridiculous crap I've ever read came out of a comic book, so this Blake scene is rather tame in comparison to most "comic book logic".

 

[shauner111]

And speaking of Inception, I've never really been bothered by the exposition in it, haha. I think it serves the plot and the movie itself well and when exposition does that, I give it a pass.

Still, The Prestige takes the cake in terms of favourite Nolan flick. I think that movie is pretty close to perfect. Gotta watch it again to make sure.

Exactly.

I haven't seen Prestige in years. Good movie but I've seen some great videos analyzing it and now I need to see it again soon. Such an underrated movie.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

I just watched The Prestige for the first time last night (10 years too late, I know)

Was absolutely floored. So freaking good.

 

[BatLobster]

The reason the Blake scene doesn't really bother me is I think it's a fairly clever inversion of the typical, "We're the same" moment that usually happens in Robin origin stories when Bruce and Dick start to bond (IE in Batman Forever after Dick finds out Bruce's identity and is acting reckless). In this case, instead of Bruce acting as a father figure trying to offer guidance to a young kindred spirt, we have an orphaned young man who's clearly wise beyond his years reaching out to a Bruce who's lost his way and trying to snap him out of his funk.

While the scene totally forecasts the ending, the ending also wouldn't have worked at all if the scene wasn't there. And given that this movie had no room whatsoever for a typical Robin origin story, nor would I want one in the movie, I'm fine with that. Sure, it takes some suspension of disbelief in terms of Blake being able to be so intuitive based just off a look...but at the same time, I'm also okay with that because it plants the seeds of him having incredibly good instincts which is important for him both as a detective and Batman's eventual successor. It's also not even close to the biggest suspension of disbelief that's required for this movie or series in general. Finally I think the writing of the monologue, JGL's performance, Bale's reaction and the score there are work together there to sell me on the moment.

Also cool is I think the scene is somewhat of a mirror to the campfire scene in Begins when Ra's reveals his sense of loss and anger over his wife to Bruce.

"...that impossible anger strangling the grief, until the memory of your loved one is just poison in your veins."

"Not a lot of people know what it feels like to be angry, in your bones."***

I see a parallel there in how both Ra's and Blake use similar analogies to convey a deep-rooted anger that's underneath the skin at all times. I guess I also appreciate the symmetry in Bruce's mentor and future successor both opening up to him in similar ways.

***All proceeds go to the Save Travesty Fund.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

I think Nolan being a prude is as much of a myth as his movies being emotionally cold.

Myth? Have you seen his movies? The most risque he has ever gotten was that one character in his first film Following sniffing on some chick's panties.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I just watched The Prestige for the first time last night (10 years too late, I know)

Was absolutely floored. So freaking good.

My favorite Nolan film.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

It's terrible that nobody else in the trilogy didn't figure it out. I find the Blake scene more realistic, while everything else in the comics and movies, as far as not figuring out Batman's identity, to be unrealistic. I'm not surprised that hardcore comic book fans would find that scene ridiculous. The only complaints I see about that scene comes from big batman comic book geeks. No offense but it's true. I've always been a fan of the comics but not hardcore. Like myself, the big film fans who don't read comics too often tend to understand that scene and it's logic. Not trying to pick a fight but this seems to be the case at least from my perspective. I really only see hardcore batman comic guys (and gals) pick on this scene endlessly. Which makes me laugh since it's one of the more realistic scenes of the entire trilogy. And yes, there's nothing wrong with putting two and two together. That's what cinema is for. Not every single thing Nolan does involves holding your hand...even though he does that a lot.

Just because it's done that way in the comics doesn't make the comics the RIGHT way. Some of the most ridiculous crap I've ever read came out of a comic book, so this Blake scene is rather tame in comparison to most "comic book logic".

If we are gonna put the movies through that much of a realism filter, might as well throw out the concept of Batman itself. A 'realistic' Batman won't survive more than a week.

 

[The Batman]

I don't think Blake knowing Batman's identity just from a look is stupid because I'm a comic book fan.

I think Blake knowing Batman's identity just from a look is stupid because it's stupid.

It's cool to like TDKR, but let's not go into Snyder fanboy territory with the defenses.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

He felt it in his bones and stuff though.

 

[The Joker]

I don't think Blake knowing Batman's identity just from a look is stupid because I'm a comic book fan.

I think Blake knowing Batman's identity just from a look is stupid because it's stupid.

It's cool to like TDKR, but let's not go into Snyder fanboy territory with the defenses.

Its the only type of defense that works for that scene It just doesn't make sense. Aside from it not making sense in how he figured it out, if Batman's identity was that simple to figure out there would be more than the hothead who would know.

Myth? Have you seen his movies? The most risque he has ever gotten was that one character in his first film Following sniffing on some chick's panties.

Tacit, are you feeling a strong urge to get laid lately or something because you keep bringing up sexual stuff? Since when do you associate a movie's emotional core with sniffing panties?

 

[Tacit Ronin]

I brought it up like once.

And I was responding to the idea that him being a prude is a myth. No. I don't associate a movie's core with 'sniffing panties'.

 

[The Batman]

Its the only type of defense that works for that scene It just doesn't make sense. Aside from it not making sense in how he figured it out, if Batman's identity was that simple to figure out there would be more than the hothead who would know.

Yup.

Logically, the only thing Blake should've deduced is that deep down, Bruce being a billionaire playboy probably didn't make him happy. That's not enough to deduce that he's Batman, though.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

This conversation is getting weird.

I just watched The Prestige for the first time last night (10 years too late, I know)

Was absolutely floored. So freaking good.

I don't know why I thought Batman was the jerk the first time I've seen it.
Looked weird seeing Wolverine being the actual jerk on my second view of it.

 

[The Joker]

I brought it up like once.

And I was responding to the idea that him being a prude is a myth. No. I don't associate a movie's core with 'sniffing panties'.

I'm talking about last night when you were getting high sexual overtones from Batman saving Rachel

Yup.

Logically, the only thing Blake should've deduced is that deep down, Bruce being a billionaire playboy probably didn't make him happy. That's not enough to deduce that he's Batman, though.

Exactly. Plus a lot of rich and famous people hide their unhappiness by putting on a front like that. Look how shocked we all were to find out Robin Williams was suicidal for years.

 

[BatLobster]

I don't think Blake knowing Batman's identity just from a look is stupid because I'm a comic book fan.

I think Blake knowing Batman's identity just from a look is stupid because it's stupid.

It's cool to like TDKR, but let's not go into Snyder fanboy territory with the defenses.

It's fine if you think it's stupid. I get it, and I get that a lot of people took issue with that scene. I just felt like expressing why the scene works for me, not trying to change anyone's mind.

An extreme Snyder fan would be telling you it's pure artistic genius that you can't appreciate...I'm just saying it's a scene/idea that plays a bit fast and loose with logic, but goes for more of an emotional hook and it works for me, especially in the larger context of the movie. Maybe I'm a bit of a sap for that, but I'm okay with that.

 

[The Joker]

It's fine if you think it's stupid. I get it, and I get that a lot of people took issue with that scene. I just felt like expressing why the scene works for me, not trying to change anyone's mind.

Personally never for a second thought you were. That's a common forum myth. Some people think because you express your opinion that you're trying to make everyone have the same opinion as yourself.

An extreme Snyder fan would be telling you it's pure artistic genius that you can't appreciate.

This is true

 

[The Batman]

It's fine if you think it's stupid. I get it, and I get that a lot of people took issue with that scene. I just felt like expressing why the scene works for me, not trying to change anyone's mind.

I didn't have a problem with your post, Shauner was asserting that only hardcore comic fans had a problem with how Blake deduced he was Batman. Thinking about it, I don't even know why that was said, as the idea of a Robin deducing Batman's identity is something that comes from the comics anyway.